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General:

Profession (current or intended):

Fields of interest:

Talents:

Hobbies:

Favorite music and why:

Religion:

Temper:

Suppose....

You know somebody wants you. Do you: tend to loose interest in them / like them more because this means they won't leave you / like them more because they must be good people if they like you

Someone somehow arranged for you to be exposed naked in front of a lot of people. How would you feel? What will you do?

Some friend would think you are a terrible person if you date his ex-girlfriend. How would you feel? What will you do?

Nobody liked you anymore: Would you search for what is wrong with you, with them, or both? which one first (if both)?

Your boss asks you to do something irrational, like writing a summary based on wrong premises. What would you do?

You can get a raise by sucking up to your boss (or teacher). What would you do?

A friend asks you how her new dress looks like, and you think it is ugly. What will you answer?

You are invited to participate on a one day trip in a hot-air-balloon, NOW, today, with people you don't know but who seem trust worthy. What will you do?

A not-so-close-friend wants to set you up on a blind date, with someone he thinks suits you. Will you go? Why?

You see your dream man/woman on the street while driving, you exchange looks. Will you make a u-turn ASAP and ask his/her number, or keep on driving? Why?

Someone you met was calling you a lot and asking to meet and talk with you frequently. Would it mean that: They're pathetic! why can't they get a life without me? / If they really like me they must be someone special

You wanted to know if someone likes you. Would you: Try to find out in an indirect way/ ask it directly / be afraid they would answer that they don't like me and not ask at all.

(give score from 0-10 to each possible answer):

How do you choose which movies you want to go see? look at reviews/ ask friends/ read the summary/ decide according to actors/ decide according to director?

Which paintings do you usually prefer? Scenery nature/ scenery man-made / scenery: combination of man-made and nature / human beings looking at the viewer, or facing the viewer / human beings with their back to the viewer

Rate significance of the following character traits: Honesty, Selfishness, integrity, independence, intelligence, productivity, self-discipline, humor, optimism, directness, assertiveness, refusal to compromise, beauty, critical thinking, self-acquaintance, creativity, politeness, passion for certain things.

To know someone, you need to: listen to what they say/ look at their eyes/ look at their actions/ expressions and body language / learn about their past

Upon meeting a new person I... Try to make them like me by doing things I think they would like / try to learn as much as possible about them / tell them the things I'm proud of so they would want to stick around / doing things they might find insulting to see how well they deal with it / reveal personal details about myself to see if they would like me for me / do unconventional things to see if they would frown at it / do everything in the conventional, normal way to not scare them off

Knowledge in the following subjects is important Psychology / philosophy / economics / law / general sciences / history / your own self / current events / other (specify)

More general questions:

Your opinion of purely physical sex: would have it if had the chance / disgusting / it's amoral: it might be good for other people but not for me

Do you usually Take someone else with you to shop for clothing? Why/ why not?

Opinion about Revenge:

How long does it take, in your view, to know someone thoroughly? Define thoroughly.

Paintings of fairies, are: magical and pretty/ irrational and useless

Paintings with an overall blur, or big blurry parts: Leave room for imagination and are therefor better than fully detailed ones / convey an incomplete idea and are therefor less good than detailed ones

Spending a day laying in the sun on the beach is: (1) Nice relaxation (2) A waist of a good working-day

The main reason you work is for: money / pleasure from the job / other (specify)

If your emotion tells you one thing but your reason tells you another, and you have to decide which one to act on, RIGHT NOW, would probably choose: reason / emotion

When I need to know if something is moral, I: Open a book on Objectivism to check the bottom line of what Ayn Rand said about it/ Think for myself until I get the answer, even if it burns my brains out/ Read what Ayn Rand said about it, and try to tackle it, until I have integrated the answer with the rest of my knowledge.

I usually treat better: old, close friends / new people who have no prior knowledge (impression) of me

People deserve my respect: only if they are perfect / to the extent that they are good

I enjoy people, who in their temperament: are more like me / are different than me

After a first date, is it possible that you ever (under full sobriety): have sex with your date?

For those who said "yes" to the question above: Will you consider your date cheap for sleeping with you right on your first date?

If someone you are interested in doesn't call you, will you: wait until they do, because it may indicate that they don't like you / call them yourself and ask them out

What is more important: The ability to think / the ability to feel / both are equally important

Do you identify a man of virtue by: How others react to him / The amount of communication he has with others (specify if more is better or worse) / Their achievements / Their verbally expressed ideas

If someone has a lot of friends it means that: He got extremely lucky and found men of quality / He sees the good in people and is able to enjoy their friendship to the extent that they are good/ He must have a poor set of values to begin with

Which is more important: success or happiness?

When you're in a lecture of some sort and you have a question do you: Ask the teacher in front of the whole class (when it is allowed) / Keep the question for myself to not slow down the others / Keep the question to myself to not look like a darn fool / other (specify)

When you are playing against someone and they beat you: Get angry at myself for being a looser / Get frustrated and upset because someone is better than you / Enjoy the fact that you have played against someone very good

When you no longer like someone you were in touch with, do you: Let them guess on their own, cause they're no longer worth the time it would take to lay it out for them / Take the time to let them know about it / Drop some hints in hope they would get it

What makes something personal for you?

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Can you give us a little context?

What is the point of this personality test? Who wrote it and for what purpose?

Why do my reasons matter to you? These questions are already posted here for everyone to use, if they have a reason and motivation to. In fact, I am adding this as one of the questions: Why did you fill out this "personality test" (and posted your answer)?

Since I added this as a question, I don't want to give my own purpose (for posting it here), because then it can be used as an answer to why someone decided to post. I can answer though that I composed it.

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Why do my reasons matter to you?

Because it might help answer the question, "Why should your survey matter to us?"

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I wouldn't mind filling out this survey, but I would like to know what purpose it serve first. This isn't MySpace.

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Because it might help answer the question, "Why should your survey matter to us?"

You should be the one giving an answer to this question, not me. If it is of interest to you to fill it out - go ahead. But I won't be supplying any reasons if you don't have your own. (see my answer below to EC)

I wouldn't mind filling out this survey, but I would like to know what purpose it serve first. This isn't MySpace.

"Wouldn't mind"? Is this a favor you are doing for me? If so, save it. Please fill it in only if you have your own reason to want to do it. You asked "what purpose would it serve" but you omitted the question whose purpose. If it is mine purpose, I don't see why your actions should be motivated by my purpose. And if it is your purpose, then why ask me about your own purpose? If you don't have one, don't expect me to supply one for you.

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Your personality test reads more like an overview of a broad spectrum of unrelated topics, Ifat. Personally, I don't understand your 0-10 rating system, and clearly it is at least unscientific. So if I were to fill out the survey for any purpose of my own, it would amount to just writing down my already-known conclusions on things, for myself! That is, for me it would serve no purpose.

So, if you would like me (and maybe other people) to fill this out, you're going to have to provide a purpose; perhaps something interesting I haven't considered, which may lead to an interesting discussion. As it stands, however, so many discussions are possible from your post (so many of the questions require a lot of context), and so many have already been gone over elsewhere on the forum, and your test doesn't really read as a test. It amounts to too much for a single thread.

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Ifat,

The motivation for any such survey has to be provided by the survey-creator. If it was a short survey of a couple of questions (like a poll on the forum), then people will often fill it in, simply because it is posted by a "forum friend", which is motivation enough for such a small effort. However, people will almost never respond to something longer, unless they are shown a reason to do so.

For instance, would you be likely fill out a survey like this, if it was posted by someone else. Remember, the fact that someone else posted it, would make the questions appear less interesting than they do to you; also, the fact that someone else posted, would make some answer-choice seem ambiguous. If that were the case, would you answer a survey of this size?

Edited by softwareNerd

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Well hell, I'm game.

General:

Profession (current or intended): Graduate student in Biological Anthropology, intending to be a researcher/professor

Fields of interest: biology but specifically behavioral ecology, philosophy, synthesizing broad knowledge bases

Talents: You're going to make me list but a few? Seriously, though, I dabble in a bit of everything, but don't often put the time in to become really good. The exception would be my academic career which I am very serious about. But I am also athletic, playing several sports, sing and play several instruments, write fiction and nonfiction, and even draw a little. Also, are video games a talent?

Hobbies: OK, video games would be a hobby. See "talents" above. I would also add spending entirely too much time on the computer counts as a hobby for me.

Favorite music and why: I like most of what would be considered "rock". I'm not sure what song/group would count as my favorite.

Religion: Yeah right.

Temper: Is this like temperament? Or anger-type temper? I have a really bad temper and am always struggling against violent tendencies.

Suppose....

You know somebody wants you. Do you: like them more because they must be good people if they like you, but cautiously because I don't tend to be trusting.

Someone somehow arranged for you to be exposed naked in front of a lot of people. How would you feel? What will you do? Oh crap, where's my pants???

Some friend would think you are a terrible person if you date his ex-girlfriend. How would you feel? What will you do? We would need to talk about it. I want to know why this person wouldn't want me to date the ex and on what basis they think it makes me terrible. If they persisted in irrational reasoning I would probably have to reevaluate the friendship.

Nobody liked you anymore: Would you search for what is wrong with you, with them, or both? which one first (if both)? This is a toughie. I've dealt with this a lot. The closer someone is to me and the more I care about them the more I search for what is wrong with me that is making this valued person treat me this way. However if I do eventually conclude it was them all along I get very angry with that person for treating me unjustly. Now, if it is strangers, I just shrug and figure they're morons who can't handle me.

Your boss asks you to do something irrational, like writing a summary based on wrong premises. What would you do? I would probably try to reason with my boss and explain why he is incorrect. Maybe he just doesn't know? If he forced me to do it anyway, I would do it as best I can considering it's not really possible to do it right, and if this sort of thing was a regular event I'd be finding a way to leave that job ASAP.

You can get a raise by sucking up to your boss (or teacher). What would you do? Yeah, but I can get a raise by being a better worker too. I don't mind taking steps to get my good work noticed by a superior, but that to me isn't sucking up, it's advocating for yourself. I would never "suck up" in the traditional sense to anyone.

A friend asks you how her new dress looks like, and you think it is ugly. What will you answer? I'd probably make fun of her. I tend to have friendships where we freely dog on each other and can be honest. What kind of friend would I be if I let her traipse around in public like that without even knowing how terrible she looked?

You are invited to participate on a one day trip in a hot-air-balloon, NOW, today, with people you don't know but who seem trust worthy. What will you do? Oh boy, hot air balloon! Can I fiddle with the controls?

A not-so-close-friend wants to set you up on a blind date, with someone he thinks suits you. Will you go? Why? I don't really do blind dates. If they want me to meet someone I'll meet them but I won't make a "date", we'll just hang out and talk perhaps.

You see your dream man/woman on the street while driving, you exchange looks. Will you make a u-turn ASAP and ask his/her number, or keep on driving? Why? Er, there's no way I could tell my dream guy just by looking at him. I can't even decide if I like someone unless I talk to them a bit. If he's really someone who's going to be important in my life, I'll probably run into him somewhere else.

Someone you met was calling you a lot and asking to meet and talk with you frequently. If they really like me they must be someone special BUT this would really depend on how I felt about them before they started calling a lot etc. If we were getting along great I would probably be really happy, but if we were barely acquaintances I would question why this person is spending so much energy on me.

You wanted to know if someone likes you. Would you: Try to find out in an indirect way. If I liked someone but wasn't sure how they felt I would probably spend a bit of time with them doing something where you really interact with the other person, and see what the dynamic was like. If I felt good about it I might ask outright. I would also try to show them how I felt by the way I was acting, but I would not go overboard and advertise it.

(give score from 0-10 to each possible answer):

How do you choose which movies you want to go see? look at reviews 5/ ask friends 8/ read the summary 7/ decide according to actors 3/ decide according to director 1

Which paintings do you usually prefer? Scenery nature 7/ scenery man-made 5/ scenery: combination of man-made and nature 9/ human beings looking at the viewer, or facing the viewer 8/ human beings with their back to the viewer 6 I should note that my favorite type of art isn't listed. I prefer paintings/drawings that convey a sense of story, with someone doing something, where you feel like it's just a snapshot of a great moment

Rate significance of the following character traits: Honesty 9, Selfishness 8, integrity 8, independence 10, intelligence 9, productivity 6, self-discipline 8, humor 9, optimism 5, directness 7, assertiveness 8, refusal to compromise 7, beauty 4, critical thinking 10, self-acquaintance 8, creativity 9, politeness 3, passion for certain things 8.

To know someone, you need to: listen to what they say 7/ look at their eyes 8/ look at their actions 10/ expressions and body language 9/ learn about their past 8

Upon meeting a new person I... Try to make them like me by doing things I think they would like 3/ try to learn as much as possible about them 6/ tell them the things I'm proud of so they would want to stick around 6/ doing things they might find insulting to see how well they deal with it 8/ reveal personal details about myself to see if they would like me for me 8/ do unconventional things to see if they would frown at it 6/ do everything in the conventional, normal way to not scare them off 1

Knowledge in the following subjects is important Psychology 5/ philosophy 6/ economics 8/ law 5/ general sciences 9/ history 8/ your own self 10/ current events 7/ other (specify)

Even though some things are more important to know than others I really think all knowledge is worth pursuing if you get the chance

More general questions:

Your opinion of purely physical sex: Even though I have never done it I know I have the capacity to enjoy it. However, the frame of mind I would have to be in to find it valuable is not a healthy state of mind for me and REALLY not good for the person I'd be with.

Do you usually Take someone else with you to shop for clothing? Why/ why not? I rarely shop. Occasionally I will take someone with me to hang out and talk but I am just as likely to decide I need something, pop in and grab it alone, and leave.

Opinion about Revenge: I am frequently tempted to take sweet, dark revenge on those who have wronged me or those I love. I would be the first to admit I probably devote too much energy to such thoughts.

How long does it take, in your view, to know someone thoroughly? Define thoroughly. I think it really depends on the circumstances in which you meet them. I think during periods of rapid life change and acclimation, or extreme circumstances, you can get to know someone well very quickly, especially if you care about them. However, I also believe there are other levels of knowing someone that only become apparent after you have known someone over a period of years. Beware of anyone you can know completely in a short amount of time, because there ain't much there.

Paintings of fairies, are: magical and pretty, BUT it has to be a GOOD painting

Paintings with an overall blur, or big blurry parts: Every time I see a painting which is blurry in parts I feel compelled to try to wipe the smudge away so I can see what's going on, even though clearly it doesn't work that way.

Spending a day laying in the sun on the beach is: Sounds like fun, but I'd rather be in the water swimming

The main reason you work is for: I always promised myself I would only engage in a career for the love of the work.

If your emotion tells you one thing but your reason tells you another, and you have to decide which one to act on, RIGHT NOW, would probably choose: Well, I was going to say reason, but then I realized the answer is a little more complicated. If it has to do with something on which I have done a lot of thinking and am confident in my conclusions but I knew for whatever reason I had this emotional reaction standing in the way, I would obviously choose reason. But if it's a brand new situation and I'm not quite sure about it I think I might go with my gut, and this is why. Good and proper reasoning can take time, and you have to check your premises. Obviously I can and do make snap judgments based on the facts at hand but the most reliable answers are found through careful introspection. In a conflict situation I might rush my reasoning and hence do it poorly. I believe that I am mature enough that my emotions can be a reliable indicator of my values. Now, that said, any decision made in the moment based on emotion needs to be examined later, in a calmer moment, to figure out whether it was correct and take steps to right any mistakes if it was incorrect.

When I need to know if something is moral, I: Think for myself until I get the answer, even if it burns my brains out.

I usually treat better: old, close friends But admittedly sometimes I treat them worse too. They get both my highs and lows because I am more honest and open with them.

People deserve my respect: to the extent that they are good

I enjoy people, who in their temperament: are more like me, BUT some differences are definitely desirable. If faced with an identical copy of myself I am not sure whether we would take over the world together or kill each other.

After a first date, is it possible that you ever (under full sobriety): have sex with your date? I would never say it is completely impossible, but the chances are so slim as to be negligible. Also, it depends on the definition of first date. If it is a longstanding friend who I have recently become romantic with, then the chances are much better than if it is someone I just met.

For those who said "yes" to the question above: Will you consider your date cheap for sleeping with you right on your first date? I'm far more concerned with how I will feel about myself, but I would probably also wonder how many other people they've done that with and as a result how can they see me as different/special

If someone you are interested in doesn't call you, will you: call them yourself and ask them out

What is more important: I believe it is more important and more useful to think and reason well, but it is important for one to own one's emotional responses and really feel them, for better or for worse - to do otherwise is self-denial and a kind of cowardice.

Do you identify a man of virtue by: Their achievements, with the understanding that I have a broad definition of achievement

If someone has a lot of friends it means that: I'm really not sure. I'm extremely distrustful of those who cultivate a wide circle of acquaintances and must be "social". Also mere compatibility is not enough, to be close friends with someone requires time and shared experiences. Otherwise they are just a potential friend or someone you feel friendly towards. There are only so many hours in a day - how many really good friends can one person make time for?

Which is more important: Happiness, but it has to be a response to something real.

When you're in a lecture of some sort and you have a question do you: Ask the teacher in front of the whole class (when it is allowed)

When you are playing against someone and they beat you: Get frustrated and upset because someone is better than you, and if the game is nontrivial I will strive to win next time.

When you no longer like someone you were in touch with, do you: Depends how close we were. The more I cared about the person the more I will try to make them understand how I feel and why. If it was really casual though, I would probably just ignore them.

What makes something personal for you? Somehow, some way, in some sense I can clearly understand, it is mine.

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Ifat,

The motivation for any such survey has to be provided by the survey-creator. If it was a short survey of a couple of questions (like a poll on the forum), then people will often fill it in, simply because it is posted by a "forum friend", which is motivation enough for such a small effort.

If anyone feels that they are filling it out for my benefit, since I am a "friend" - please don't. I don't want anyone to invest any amount of effort, small or big, to satisfy my purpose. If they don't have one of their own, I will not provide one.

However, people will almost never respond to something longer, unless they are shown a reason to do so.

Very well - then people won't reply. I am not going to show anybody a reason. I have my own reasons for posting it, I am not going to do the job for more people by coming up with reasons why they should fill it out as well.

For instance, would you be likely fill out a survey like this, if it was posted by someone else.

I wouldn't care who posted it (maybe as something very minor). I would fill it out if it gave me enough value to do so.

Remember, the fact that someone else posted it, would make the questions appear less interesting than they do to you; also, the fact that someone else posted, would make some answer-choice seem ambiguous. If that were the case, would you answer a survey of this size?

The size is insignificant, unless you were doing someone a favor by putting the effort into answering. And I am not looking for any favors.

JASKN: No purpose will be provided by me. If filling this serves no purpose for you - then don't fill it out. It's that simple. This was not meant to give a score or classification telling you who you are. It is a test without the grading method. The judge - is you, and everyone else who is able to interpret the answers and conclude about the psychological subjects involved.

I already said I won't be giving any purpose for people, so I don't see the point of your post.

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I already said I won't be giving any purpose for people, so I don't see the point of your post.
Well, you are a "forum friend" of mine, Ifat, as sNerd coined, and you wouldn't have created the thread if you didn't want participants. So, the main thrust of my post was to show you some reasons why people may not want to partake, thus defeating any purpose you may have. I think sNerd summed it up well.

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If someone felt like filling out this survey was worth while, but did not particularly care of what value it was to you, why would they even post it publicly? If your contention is to provide them with a means of some interesting introspection, is a forum whose typical context is public response the appropriate mechanism for that?

Clearly some people might find a little bit of pleasure in filling this out, and sharing their interests with other people with similar values (fellow forum members) but to some this alone might not make it worthwhile enough to fill out. But if they are helping a 'forum friend' derive some useful information which would positively contribute to the world which they also live in, or even, assist someone in doing something positive and productive for it's own sake. As Rand said, charity is fine when you derive real valuable from that which you are assisting someone in achieving, as long as it is not detrimental to you, or as Aristotle suggested, the best kinds of friendships are ones which we want what is best for our friends for their own sake, something I would think most extend here as a common courtesy to all individuals.

In short, no one is 'sacrificing' anything by filling this out 'for you' if they fill it out and post it publicly it would likely be a combination of some fun introspection, sharing interests with other forum members, and assisting you in something they would probably find productive and worthwhile. To suggest that if they know your motivation, and that if that motivation plays a part in their decision they must necessarily be sacrificing to you, or using you to find purposes for them, is something I find rather arrogant. To even LOOK at one of your posts AT ALL, would fall under the same category of you providing a 'purpose for them' and providing a reason for this survey is no different than providing the a subject title for a new thread.

I don't think the average forum member here on Objectivism online is one prone to bouts of self sacrifice, and we probably don't need hyper vigilance on your part to protect ourselves from it, nor condescension at the notion that one might find joy in assisting a fellow intelligent productive person in an intelligent productive activity.

Edited by Matus1976

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Why do my reasons matter to you? These questions are already posted here for everyone to use, if they have a reason and motivation to. In fact, I am adding this as one of the questions: Why did you fill out this "personality test" (and posted your answer)?

Since I added this as a question, I don't want to give my own purpose (for posting it here), because then it can be used as an answer to why someone decided to post. I can answer though that I composed it.

In a community full of "traders" (people who seek value for equal value), I don't see the point of posting a long personality test (with the implicit assumption that people will spend the time - a value - to fill it out) without giving us a little context as to what the test is all about. You are offering us something without giving us the information that we need to consider it's value to us. What will I get in return for filling out this test? Knowledge of myself? Do the results tell me my IQ, what kind of occupation I should hold, or how close my personality is to Ayn Rand's? Will the correct answer win me a million dollars? Just posting the quiz with no context does not entice me to answer this quiz (and lets face it, if you posted it on a public forum, you did so because you wanted people's responses). A quick "Hey guys, I just made this personality test as a fun way to get to know each other better, feel free to fill it out and we can compare answers!" is all that is needed to completely summarize all the info that one would need to judge whether or not this test is a value to take.

On a separate note, the way you are handling those who have responded is the exact opposite that is needed for people to be willing to participate in this quiz. By telling people that you don't need to explain the context of this randomly posted quiz, it's like telling them "i gave you this to do, but i'm not going to tell you why" ... what do you expect except a lot of confused and dissenting voices? Especially in a forum of people who notoriously expect reason and fact-based explanations, not "I am not going to show anybody a reason. I have my own reasons for posting it, I am not going to do the job for more people by coming up with reasons why they should fill it out as well. Well... ok, there's my reason right there NOT to take this test: I am not a whim-worshiper and I need reasons to do things. If you can't give that to me, then I see no point in taking this quiz, and I'm sure I'm not alone in this conclusion. " As Snerd pointed out: "The motivation for any such survey has to be provided by the survey-creator."

Edited by athena glaukopis

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If I were to give a full reply to your claims (Athena, Matus, and Bretz), it would have been far more insulting than anything I have wrote so far could have been for you. I am not going to go against forum rules, and therefore I am not going to reply altogether, since I can't speak my mind fully.

themadkat: Nice reply. :dough: You just forgot to answer the added question: Why did you post all of that. (Of course, this is all optional, so just letting you know in case you want to answer).

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If I were to give a full reply to your claims (Athena, Matus, and Bretz), it would have been far more insulting than anything I have wrote so far could have been for you. I am not going to go against forum rules, and therefore I am not going to reply altogether, since I can't speak my mind fully.

themadkat: Nice reply. :dough: You just forgot to answer the added question: Why did you post all of that. (Of course, this is all optional, so just letting you know in case you want to answer).

I asked a simple question. Seeing as you have given no answer and are patently refusing too I conclude that this is indeed spam and leave this to the administrators to do as they see fit.

Derrick

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If I were to give a full reply to your claims (Athena, Matus, and Bretz), it would have been far more insulting than anything I have wrote so far could have been for you.

Why do you feel a need to be insulting at all? Try a bit of heavy-stepping around before opening the text editor. Works for me when I get worked up in some online discussions.

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If I were to give a full reply to your claims (Athena, Matus, and Bretz), it would have been far more insulting than anything I have wrote so far could have been for you.

I was under the assumption that a reply to our claims would be rational arguments substantiating your side of the discussion, not insults.

I don't see how that kind of response is warranted at all, let alone why you thought it was necessary to give us a backhanded insult thinly-veiled as a "refrain from insult" -- Either choose to insult us or not; by framing an insult as if it were not an insult, it does not make A non-A.

If I were to give a full reply to your claims (Athena, Matus, and Bretz), it would have been far more insulting than anything I have wrote so far could have been for you.

I was under the assumption that a reply to our claims would be a rational arguments substantiating your side of the discussion, not insults.

I don't see how that kind of response is warranted at all, let alone why you thought it was necessary to give us a backhanded insult in the first place (especially thinly-veiled as a "refrain from insult")

Edited by athena glaukopis

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Why do you feel a need to be insulting at all? Try a bit of heavy-stepping around before opening the text editor. Works for me when I get worked up in some online discussions.

No, you misunderstood me. I do not feel like being insulting. I said what I would say would probably be insulting to them.

As far as I am concerned, it is simply the truth about what I see in their claims and requests. It just so happens that that truth conveys an unpretty image.

by the way Athena, you suggested that if I told everyone "Hey guys, I just made this personality test as a fun way to get to know each other better, feel free to fill it out and we can compare answers!" then people would gladly participate. You think I don't know that? I knew this is what you were looking to get from me from your first post. Which is why I said I do not intend to give any purpose, because such purpose would have been used as a reason by others to post ("Why are you participating?" "Well, the one who started the thread wants to get to know us all, so in the spirit of friendship I'm following her request"). And I did not wish to give anyone that option.

You don't want what you call "veil insults"? fine then. I'll offer my thoughts. I think people indulge in showing their personalities to other people. They have a social need of psychological visibility of that kind. Only, they are not very proud of that, so they rather not face or admit that fact. Instead, it would make it much easier for them to indulge in "personality showing off" if someone else was to give them the excuse in the form of "hey everybody! let's get to know each other!". And since I don't respect the act of evading one's own inner state, I was not going to provide a reason.

You see, nobody who participates and fills out the whole thing will do so out of good will toward me. That would be a pretence. The truth would be that whoever does that wants to share that knowledge with other people. If they can't admit that reason to themselves, I will not provide an excuse.

Now really, those who want to participate are welcome to do so. And those who don't are welcome to ignore it.

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Ifat, the fact that you have been asked for your purpose can also be interpreted in another way - that people won't provide you with their answers unless you give them a good reason aside from what they would have gotten in terms of visibility. It could mean that the visibility was not enough in terms of value (implicit since you also assumed that people here fail to fully grasp their motivations) for them to go through the trouble of responding. This is not the only possible explanation either but it serves my purpose. Based on what criteria have you excluded that (because you have) as a possibility?

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Ifat, the fact that you have been asked for your purpose can also be interpreted in another way - that people won't provide you with their answers unless you give them a good reason aside from what they would have gotten in terms of visibility. It could mean that the visibility was not enough in terms of value (implicit since you also assumed that people here fail to fully grasp their motivations) for them to go through the trouble of responding. This is not the only possible explanation either but it serves my purpose. Based on what criteria have you excluded that (because you have) as a possibility?

I haven't excluded that as an option. In my judgement though, by the way posts here were phrased, I did not see this as the motivation for asking (and demanding at some point) A purpose (with exception, maybe, of JASKN).

It could very well be that someone (hypothetical) was looking for some interesting discussion other than the value that can be had just by visibility, and was curious to see if there is any additional value that I offer. But then it would not be phrased as "give us A purpose!" or "why should we even bother, this test is a-scientific at best" or "how dare you not give us a purpose" (which was more or less the spirit of things).

Well, I don't owe any one of you a purpose. I offered whatever value each man can have from this personality test as the sole motivation that I will offer. I invested a good amount of my time composing it, too. The value of what I offered should be self evident, even if the use or individual purpose may not be clear to everyone. (Which is why calling it "spam" is ridiculous).

People didn't seem to have problem finding motivation to participate in other "personality test" threads. What they can have from it was not stated by anyone, and no one demanded anyone else to give a reason, or provided one themselves. That thread has 93 posts and over 10,000 views.

What do you think makes this personality test special, that all of a sudden people demand I provide a purpose, when in the past no one was concerned with such a thing?

It is one thing when someone is asking for another value to be had by filling it out (like a discussion) since they don't see enough value in filling it out and posting by itself, and another when they ask that I provide them with one such as "to get to know each other better". If they want to get to know people better, why do they insist I would say it? Why can't they say "I am filling this out because I want to let other people know me better?". That is what I objected to.

It was only after some more angry replies that I concluded the motivation of asking for a purpose is definitely bad.

But in general, I am certainly not excluding any good reasons for asking for additional value. But it has to be an additional value and not "A purpose".

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Wanting to know a purpose is the same thing as wanting to know what value is gained. The first implies the second. I just wanted to make sure that this was an honest survey about members here "getting to know each other a little better" rather that some complicated psychological ruse on your part which I am now more and more believing it to be. In other words if I answered the questions to the survey I wouldn't want it construed in any way except what it really was-- my benevolently sharing some more "private" thoughts, expecting others to do so as well, so as to increase my knowledge of other member's personalities, and them learning more about mine.

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In other words if I answered the questions to the survey I wouldn't want it construed in any way except what it really was-- my benevolently sharing some more "private" thoughts, expecting others to do so as well, so as to increase my knowledge of other member's personalities, and them learning more about mine.

I don't know what you mean by "benevolent sharing". Who is to be benevolent here, and about what?

And in any case, if this is what you wanted - what does it matter to you what the thread means to me?

What do you care if I sit at home selecting from the posts the replies I like from the ones I dislike or if I sit at home thinking "OO.net members - my family!" or anything else.

Did you want me to set the tone? I just want to know. And if so, why is it needed from me?

If you want your post to be sharing something with others, why is MY intention necessary? You have thousands of other members to share things with.

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People didn't seem to have problem finding motivation to participate in other "personality test" threads. What they can have from it was not stated by anyone, and no one demanded anyone else to give a reason, or provided one themselves. That thread has 93 posts and over 10,000 views.

What do you think makes this personality test special, that all of a sudden people demand I provide a purpose, when in the past no one was concerned with such a thing?

I am really stunned at the level of combativeness you seem to have regarding this issue. First of all I'd ask you to consider that you may be psychologizing some people's responses, or not realizing that your terseness in your original reply may have been part of the cause of such responses.

2nd, the thread you seem to be comparing this one to has significant differences from this one, not to mention the fact that in that thread you specifically expressed disdain for personality tests in general as in this quote here:

Question: Why are you all interested in this personality test? What value do you get by someone else telling you who you are?

To me this seems like astrology: people go to the crystal ball (I mean newspaper) <--[stole this joke from the thread about volition] to tell them who they are, what they like, what is going to happen in their life, who is the perfect lover for them etc'.

So I figure that this must be the same type of appeal for people here: The need to be told who they are.

?Thoughts, anyone

That fact alone actually makes me concerned as to your purpose and use of the infomration I provide you. And the fact that you specifically won't divulge it has the effect of possibly looking as though you're hiding some motive. The reason is that any proper context is neither difficult to provide, nor is it harmful to do so. What I can't figure out is why for instance you seem put out to even say something like, "Guys, I'm curious about this subject and have formulated some ideas I want to test, would you please take the test?" The point is that your motive is part of the context of why I would possibly derive value from that test. That is neither dependant, nor irrational, nor non-objectivist. If you stop and think about what value any indpendant person would derive from responding to such a soliciation, you'd see that there has to be some minimum value. As given, this would only elicit responses form someone who might be curious and has nothing better to do with their time. That's very few of us. Will the test results be reported and summarized in some way? we don't know. Are you trying to test a hypothesis that we might also be interested in knowing the answer to? We don't know.

Here are the differences just in context of participation between this thread and yours.

a. the test involved is a generally well-known test. The context of it's use, and basis are generally well known to everyone. It is not necessary to provide it to have someone feel as though they can participate effectively.

b. most people in that thread didn't have to spend the time to go take the test; they already had their classification, and just reported it.

c. people can talk about the basis and theory of the test since the context and background are so well known.

None of this is true of your proposition. They are not the same. Get real.

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