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Nick Savoy

PUAs seduce then take pictures for divorce court

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I'd heard about people getting hired to "test" the faithfulness of their partner -- hire some guy to randomly meet up with your girlfriend somewhere you know she's going to be, having him approach her, see if she takes the bait (or vice versa, if you're the girl testing your boyfriend's loyalty). I think there's a company that does this in the UK, maybe there's more.

But this I hadn't really heard of before - at least not outside far-fetched courtroom dramas - people getting hired to seduce half of a couple and bring pictures to the other half for divorce court.

Read all about it in the Times of London here (hat tip - Mr. M):

http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_an...icle7119999.ece

It's interesting for more than a 'stare at the train crash' kind of way. Look at how they plan these seductions -- it's not some guy running into her at a bar. That's probably too hit or miss for guys who don't have pick up artist training, so they're smart. They set up the social context. Note the presence of other women, including at least one female friend. Note the peer approval for her actions. Note the way it "just happened" that the party continued in the hotel. Note how other people just drifted away so it "just happened" to be her and him in the hotel room at the end. Note also, alcohol B)

This fits in with a lot of stuff Love Systems (formerly The Mystery Method Corp.) talks about when it comes to dates, like:

* Use your turf, not hers

* Make logistical moves (bar to hotel, hotel party to hotel alone, etc.) seamless

* Groups are great if your friends know what they are doing

* Context matters. A lot.

-NS

(Another curious thing just hit me -- with that UK company I remember that 'tests' for loyalty, I remember reading that one of their rules was that they don't send testers/seducers who are significantly better looking than the person they are trying to test. That seems weird to me. Most guys who are worried about their wives or girlfriends cheating aren't really worried about the average guy on the corner - they're worried about how she'll react when given a chance with smooth-looking eye candy. And same for women. Odd.)

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That's pretty bizarre. I wonder if in the US this could qualify as prostitution and lead to the prosecution of a "tester" who succeeds in getting the spouse to cheat and then is paid for his/her services?

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Savoy,

Are you an Objectivist?

It would be interesting if you could start applying Objectivist principles to becoming more social and dating women, so a lot of the guys who are interested in the PUA stuff don't end up being aimless zeros who derive their self-esteem from conquest over women.

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Good Lord, I hope not!

I was curious about the technical underpinnings of how this all works, not advocating it. Sort of like watching The Wire when it was on -- it's fascinating, but didn't make me want to become a drug dealer. I'm the last person you'd get to defend Mystery. I was President of Mystery Method Corp from late 2004 until it changed its name to Love Systems.

Gags - I was kind of wondering that too. Would that be considered entrapment? Or would that even matter when most of the US is (I think) governed by 'no fault' divorces? It also just kind of made me wonder about what we expect from ourselves and our partners.

I completely agree that lasting self-esteem can't be found from repeated 'conquests'. I know people who live that way, and they are only as happy as their last conquest was recent. It's like filling a bucket with a hole it. It's a danger -- guys who have not had the success with women that they've wanted and then discover Love Systems are sometimes like the starving guy who suddenly learns that he's been living behind an all you can eat buffet his whole life and never noticed it. He might overindulge at first. I did. But it was also - for me anyway - a necessary bridge between being frustrated, not having good relationships because I was often 'settling' or wondering what else was out there, and being able to be with someone from a position of strength and choice.

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