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mustang19

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  1. Like
    mustang19 got a reaction from samr in More annoying questions   
    1. Should the US have not instated the draft during World War II? If so, what do you think would happen?

    2. Was it immoral for Ayn Rand to collect Medicare?

    3. Are public libraries a moral evil?

    4. Are Objectivists opposed to government issued fiat currency in principle?

    5. Did Ayn Rand get anything wrong?

    Not really interested in starting a shitfest this time. Just curious as to what the opinion of people here is.
  2. Like
    mustang19 got a reaction from Tenderlysharp in Self-interest versus rights   
    Well TS I was able to find a full copy of Gault's speech via a Google search. So I'll look into it in a week or so once I get off school. And if I come to any revelations I'll get back to you. Thanks regardless.
  3. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Sirius1 in Self-interest versus rights   
    What? Isn't the pleasure-pain mechanism the guardian of one's life, dude?
  4. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Xall in Self-interest versus rights   
    Not sure of that; Wikipedia at least defines it as "a focus on the needs or desires of oneself" without mention of other people. But if I argue about dictionary definitions anymore I'm going to get banned.



    I guess the closest term you could come to that is Pareto efficiency, where at least one person is better off and no one else worse off. Don't know if it's in most dictionaries though.



    Well since you're still feeding the troll I would go with the Wikipedia definition of self interest, since, although it is from Wikipedia, I believe it is one of the more commonly understood definitions of the word and people will usually have a good idea of what I mean when I use it.
  5. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Sirius1 in Self-interest versus rights   
    Not sure of that; Wikipedia at least defines it as "a focus on the needs or desires of oneself" without mention of other people. But if I argue about dictionary definitions anymore I'm going to get banned.



    I guess the closest term you could come to that is Pareto efficiency, where at least one person is better off and no one else worse off. Don't know if it's in most dictionaries though.



    Well since you're still feeding the troll I would go with the Wikipedia definition of self interest, since, although it is from Wikipedia, I believe it is one of the more commonly understood definitions of the word and people will usually have a good idea of what I mean when I use it.
  6. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Sirius1 in Self-interest versus rights   
    If so I'm just going off of the information provided in this thread. Let's break out an actual dictionary. Going off of:



    http://thesaurus.com/browse/self-indulgence

    Main Entry: selfishness
    Part of Speech: noun
    Definition: self-regard
    Synonyms: greed, self-centeredness, self-indulgence, self-worship, stinginess

    Main Entry: enjoyment
    Part of Speech: noun
    Definition: delight in something
    Synonyms: amusement, delectation, diversion, enjoying, entertainment, fruition, fun, gladness, gratification, gusto, happiness, hedonism, indulgence, joy, loving, luxury, pleasure, recreation, rejoicing, relaxation, relish, satisfaction, savor, self-indulgence, sensuality, thrill, triumph, zest
    Antonyms: displeasure, dissatisfaction, misery, sorrow, unhappiness, woe

    So just from a brief purview of a crappy online thesaurus it can be seen that selfishness and hedonism are closely related terms if not synonyms. Whether or not psychological egoism or any other theory dealing with self interest is "correct" is irrelevant to my point; the common definition of the word self interest as used in these theories equates self interest with pleasure to some degree or another.

    I'm getting conflicting answers to my questions in this thread, though, so I should just drop it rather than try to see which one of you is the true voice of Ayn Rand. Sorry if I sounded like a dork there, but I don't see it so much as an issue of me understanding Ayn Rand so much as people in this thread saying words making words out to mean something other than their usual definitions. Now go ahead and give my post 100 down votes like a youtube video of Justin Bieber.
  7. Like
    mustang19 reacted to 2046 in Self-interest versus rights   
    Obviously Objectivism challenges that any denial of rights to others is in your rational self-interest. Why is denying the right of life to others beneficial for you? You would be no better than an animal then. A parasitic one, since you depend on the productivity of others. What are you going to do when your hosts don't support you anymore, for example, if you kill them off, or if they stop producing, or can't support both you and them?

    Since you have abandoned rationality, how then can you justify this state of affairs? Certainly not by appeal to logic.

    Most dictators were psychotics and megalomaniacs, and drove their nations into destruction while piling up mountains of skulls, until their own people or the enemies they made killed them. Is psychosis your standard of mental health? And is dying by the sword you lived by your standard of well living, then?
  8. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Sirius1 in Self-interest versus rights   
    The fact that you're a hedonist doesn't prevent you from thinking long-term either. Deciding to endure painful surgery for more use out of your joints afterwards isn't at all incompatible with hedonism, just as long as whatever use you get out of the joint is worth it. Being a hedonist in no way requires you to be a drug addict either, in fact even a hedonist would probably not want to be one.

    I really wish you guys would pick a word besides "self interest" if you're talking about something that differs from the accepted definition of the term in important ways. It gets pretty confusing when someone asks you very basic questions about your philosophy and your response is to tell them to read a 2000 page book about how you don't mean what you sound like you mean. Not ones for finding beauty in conciseness are you all? Disclaimer: The previous paragraph was a troll.
  9. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Xall in Self-interest versus rights   
    Hm, so much for those ARI junkies then.

    http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/pleasure_and_pain.html



    Just going off of the sources it was suggested I look into...

    But I understand that when you say "the pleasure pain mechanism is the automatic guardian of man's life" you actually mean something else. It still makes Objectivism unnecessarily confusing though since psychological egoism is usually understood to include pleasure in the evaluation of self interest. There are probably more accurate and precise words to describe whatever Rand actually meant by "self interest".
  10. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from 2046 in Self-interest versus rights   
    Hm, so much for those ARI junkies then.

    http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/pleasure_and_pain.html



    Just going off of the sources it was suggested I look into...

    But I understand that when you say "the pleasure pain mechanism is the automatic guardian of man's life" you actually mean something else. It still makes Objectivism unnecessarily confusing though since psychological egoism is usually understood to include pleasure in the evaluation of self interest. There are probably more accurate and precise words to describe whatever Rand actually meant by "self interest".
  11. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from Sirius1 in More annoying questions   
    Yeah. Well that's what's so interesting about this forum.

    I have another question. What is the Objectivist take on government led disaster relief efforts? Say the response to Hurricane Katrina or the recent tornadoes in the south. Or even the cleanup and evacuation efforts of the Soviet government after Chernobyl. Would a proper Objectivist state have something along the lines of FEMA or would disaster victims pretty much be left to fend for themselves or rely on private charity?

    An additional question: Can you point out a historical example of a society that more or less followed Objectivist principles pretty closely?

    Finally: What do you think would happen if the world suddenly "turned Objectivist", that is if all the people in the world realized the Objectivist position was right? Sudden technological and industrial renaissance or something along those lines?
  12. Like
    mustang19 got a reaction from volco in More annoying questions   
    Thanks for the responses guys. Although I'd like a better idea of what you think the results of the US not instating the draft in World War II would be like. Did it not matter at all whether the US got involved in World War II? Would it be fine if (for the sake of argument) Hitler won the war because the US couldn't conscript people?

    Here's question #6 for you. Are drivers licenses a moral evil? That is, is it wrong for the government to require you to get a driver's license before you can drive a car? Do two year olds have an inalienable natural right to operate a motor vehicle?

    Question #7. Should personal ownership of nuclear weapons be legal?
  13. Downvote
    mustang19 got a reaction from 2046 in More annoying questions   
    Thanks for the responses guys. Although I'd like a better idea of what you think the results of the US not instating the draft in World War II would be like. Did it not matter at all whether the US got involved in World War II? Would it be fine if (for the sake of argument) Hitler won the war because the US couldn't conscript people?

    Here's question #6 for you. Are drivers licenses a moral evil? That is, is it wrong for the government to require you to get a driver's license before you can drive a car? Do two year olds have an inalienable natural right to operate a motor vehicle?

    Question #7. Should personal ownership of nuclear weapons be legal?
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