CrowEpistemologist

Uh yeah, that's totally what I meant. I'm a socialist, totally. That's why I find this law so ghastly, because I hate free enterprise.

Oh, ya think? :-)

Wow, that's right out of the governor's official talking points--that the change in the law was one word so... big deal, right? Absolutely incredible to see people who apparently call themselves "objectivists" defending this blatantly socialist move. Incredible.

Tesla isn't going to do it alone, and they are going to compromise if they need to. They are small a business with an interest in succeeding, not martyrs. Maybe in some states they will be the proverbial Jane Roe, but in the mean time they are going to do what they need to do, even if it means paying off the looters for a little while. What needs to happen to Snider and the other Repubs who voted for this law is for them to lose the next election because of low voter turnout by their party. That will send the right message.

A complete reading of my post above will reveal that I pointed out both parties were in on this--although Republicans coming out in favor of a blatantly socialist law (right out of AS, see Anti-dog-eat-dog) is a little more newsworthy. Only a little though, these days. A common refrain you'll hear from me is that today's Republicans hardly resemble the Repubs from even 20 years ago. They've become the populist party in the USA, taking over that mantel from that Demos before them.

This sucks more than anything has sucked in a very long time: http://online.wsj.com/articles/gm-urges-michigan-gov-to-sign-anti-tesla-bill-1413912419 It's worth noting that Republicans were very much behind this in MI, as well as our Demo bailed-out friends at GM... And while I don't indulge in off-topic rants too often, I'll say in the most objective terms I can that car dealers are lower than the deepest layer of prehistoric frog shit at the bottom of a New Jersey scum swamp. They add absolutely no value to our civilization. They could all go away tomorrow and we'd all be better off. I think of the countless, pointless hours I've spent in car dealers trying to by a fucking car after I walked in and knew exactly what I wanted and had cash for it. You can go to the local jeweler and buy a $30k watch in 5 minutes. A $30k car takes 2 hours. What bullshit. They only get away with this because they are a government-protected monopoly. The sick part is that they seem to know it and enjoy a sick power trip as they hold you there captive waiting for a 80s-vintage printer to ooze out a 15 page "contract" and try to up-sell you floor mats and sealer wax or whatever the high-end equivalent is these days. In other words, I didn't think it was possible to hate car dealers any more than I did before today, but I was wrong.

This is an aside, but how would a government control the exchange rate? I can see them simply making the purchase of foreign currency illegal for their own citizens, but that would stop trade altogether, not affect prices. Anyhow, I used foreign currency as an example, but any sort of investment instrument could do the same job. If a government wanted to force its citizens to stick with their holdings in their currency, they'd need to basically stop trade altogether. I suspect in the future (present?) currency inflation is only going to be looked at as a way for governments to write down their sovereign debt in a granular way. Sort of an international Chapter 11 of sorts--and it applies specifically to the government of a country, not to the country itself...

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/07/02/business/is-a-cashless-society-on-the-cards/index.html?iid=article_sidebar An interesting article about the decline of paper currency in civilized society. One can surmise that the absolute end of physical paper/metal currency is not far off. The technology is now ubiquitous and the advantages are palpable. As I discussed in an earlier post, this has wider economic implications as it is the first step in greatly reducing or even eliminating a government's ability to harm anybody with currency inflation. If nobody actually carries any physical currency, then the whole of our liquid net worth--every last penny--is stored in computer memory somewhere, which can be rapidly manipulated and quickly traded out of any particular currency instantly and automatically, making the currency your savings is denominated essentially meaningless. The existence of this phenomenon would in turn make intentional currency inflation self-defeating for any government that tried it.

JASKN, I'm not questioning your integrity. I'm simply curious as to how you came to get he experience you are recounting. I was trying to learn about your specific environment. I can use Wikipedia too :-). I live in a metro area that is probably similar in mix, but where I actually live there are virtually no black people, for instance. You seemed to indicate you work in a blue-collar warehouse environment with a racial mix. Good to know. Presumably you banter with these people, no? None of them talk about being unfairly or unusually targeted by the police? Here's another anecdote for you. I once dated a woman who had traveled all over the world and lived in Europe for a while. Then she had to attend a wedding of a friend in (somewhere in the deep South I forget where). I recall her being shocked at what she saw and heard, and her overall comment was that culturally that place she was in was more different than any of the European countries she visited. Y'all ever visited the deep South? :-)

JASKN, what percentage of the population where you live (i.e. the specific neighborhood) is black? Other minority? How often do you talk to police officers in lengthy casual conversation? How often do you talk to simple laborers who aren't as... polite in their manner of speaking? How many of your friends or co-workers are black? Do you ever talk to them about how they are treated by the police? Would your parents have gleefully sent you to a mostly-black school if they had a choice? You obviously live in a different sort of environment some others of us do, so I'm curious what that environment looks like.

I would agree that the problem of racism in the USA broadly breaks up into two subjects, one being economic, and the other being civil. I think the latter subject is simpler, more relevant, and probably more actionable in the shorter run. The poll in the OP has questions that directly related to this side of the issue, and most of the questions there seem to generally related to it as well.

My parents were nice to black people when they met them, but no way would they ever move to a black neighborhood or send me to a predominately black school. They'd be inclined to vote in a race-neutral way, but they were certainly derisive toward them in private, and this would surely color their decision making in a variety of areas e.g. crime, hiring, social association, etc. This was true of every grown-up I knew growing up, and is true for about half of the fellow adults I consort with now in various walks of life. In short, I've personally experienced lots of racism, and lots of meaningful problems associated with it, for both sides of the perpetration. I'd surely love to hear where all of these people live (Galt's Gulch perhaps?) where racism is a thing of the past and everybody is color blind, and anybody who says any different are just bitching and moaning about non-existent problems. Where is this utopia? It's certainly noplace I've ever visited.

Got it. So based on the fact that "network media" has a vested interest in there being more racism than there is, it's logical conclude that there isn't, in reality, very much racism present in our society. I guess blacks and other minorities, by that logic, should be thankful that "network media" exists and it does what it does. Otherwise they might very will be effected by racism a lot more. By that logic. Interesting logic you have there...

Correct, nobody said that.

I guess since black people are racists it's okay that white people are racists too. I mean, why else would you even bring this up in this discussion? Sorta like when we talk about defending our country against criminals and people "respond" by pointing out that we had slavery in the USA, and we took land from the Indians, bla bla bla... "Just saying", they say... "Just pointing out a fact", they say... So yeah, when I ask if there's significant racism against minorities in the USA, and the answer I get is, "well you know racism among blacks is really bad", or, "define racism!", or (my personal favorite), "I'm afraid for my family that black people are going to come and lynch us!", you know, I think I have my answer... :-)

All that said, I think I pretty much have my answer... Thanks everybody...

Next time I will check the box that shows everybody's vote. I guess that will make things clearer next time.

Oh I see the problem. Yes, I'm confused. Whereas in the poll lots of people listed "significant problem" and only one person listed "not significant at all", virtually everybody here seems to agree that racism against minorities is not a problem, or "not really" a problem, or not as big a problem as other problems, etc. etc. such that we can safely ignore the problem (so linked in the OP), or a problem made up in moocher's heads, etc. etc. And yes, a discussion. Fine. Maybe start your discussion with your clear answer to the question? Otherwise you sound evasive...

Actually the poll doesn't have people's names on it...

Yeah, lucky me. I started a thread on a particular subject and you re-interpreted it to mean a different subject so you could then attack a straw man.

Yeah, that's not what I asked, nor what the poll asked. You see my problem here?

???

It's fascinating that most people here haven't provided a straight-forward answer to a fairly simple question (one exception being Harrison, who was crystal clear in his views). Yes, there are many dimensions to the problems of race in the USA, but that's not what I asked. Sure, a simple question might spawn additional questions and discussion, but usually when people do that, they answer the initial question first, and then proceed to expand on other related problems. Is my question invalid somehow? Maybe I can demonstrate what a straight-forward answer to this question looks like: Yes, racism remains a widespread and significant problem for minorities in the USA. Many Americans are irrational and bigoted, and this causes problems for minorities that are unjust and/or immoral. Was that so hard?

"Good science" that is never wrong isn't called science, it's called faith.

Yeah, I've said about 5 times now my prediction was wrong. How's your portfolio looking Nicky? Can you buy a new plasma TV yet?