Tenderlysharp
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Posts
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Posts posted by Tenderlysharp
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By you, or by someone else?
Somebody else's rules?
...you're going to have to make your art whether or not it satisfies someone else's definition.
I appreciate that you redirect me back to searching myself for answers.
If my work isn't considered art by someone else I would like that person to describe what art is to them and/or Objectivism and offer examples.
I will consider their answers and see if they inspire me or align with my own beliefs.
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I like the deepness in the women's voices. The music has an energy that makes me want to get out and get things done.
I have often thought that people's voices should be more respected as an instrument.
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How does that site work when it comes to selling? If you put up a high-quality graphic file, will they sell things like prints for you; or does it require the artist to do more ?
Deviant Art and its affiliates offer printing and shipping services. They take 75% of the sales of art prints through their website. You can also buy advertising on their site, and interact with the community to attract interest.
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I love Romantic Realism. I have been doing in-depth studies of anatomy, especially feet and hands recently. But, I don't think I can dedicate myself purely to romantic realism for the rest of my career.
Its funny, the work Howard Roark sighted were pieces I made about 7 years ago, before I had heard of Ayn Rand. I view them as experiments in color and gesture and find beauty in the enigmatic quality of them. There is an energy to them that I don't want to loose as I become technically more proficient.
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About selling to individuals vs collectivists:
Why is that? Are you even sure that it is true?I don't think I would refuse to sell to a person who holds collectivist beliefs (I value some as friends for their other attributes). I was thinking more about resisting collectivist organizations who benefit as the median between artist and collector. Ayn Rand was warning corporations against funding their own demise. I don't want to alienate most of the art world (by refusing to sell to or through them) but if I can find a more individual based audience I would offer my work to them first.
I have a sense that you started this thread because you were looking for confirmation from people who call themselves Objectivists that your work is art according to Ayn Rand's definition. Is there any truth to my hunch?I appreciate confirmation, but if my work isn't considered art I may find value in embracing certain rules when producing future work. I need to study Ayn Rand's definition of art more thoroughly.
The 'better to be hated' is a good one to be reminded of, and thank you for the compliment.
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I find talking with Objectivists more conducive towards proper art critique. Their intellects express more concisely any context, topic, or subject matter.
Whereas artists tend to get lost in their emotions and feelings so that often when I hope for a critical analysis I won't get a response which gives me insight in to how it is perceived by other people.
I have been successful in bringing bits of reason to some emotionally chaotic artists, I like to do so as a challenge to myself, but their gratitude doesn't assuage my desire for intellectual equals.
I don't mean to come across adversarial. I am not trying to sell my art at the moment.
I am attempting to sharpen my intellectual edge, and rise to the challenge of Objectivist philosophy.
Thank you Cello and Eiuol for your praise.
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A person's time is precious. Every moment someone spends reading your words is a moment they can never get back again. You are asking for more than you are giving here.
They are trying to encourage you to be more concise.
Ayn Rand probably didn't share everything she thought.
...before the socialists destroy the world i'm trying to see if there are any quicker ways to get the answers...The quickest way is to study Ayn Rand's own writing, and extensive multi-media libraries. It can seem overwhelming at first, but keep at it and your ability to make sense of it all will improve. I have some of her voice on my Ipod, each time I hear something she says the more it means to me.
Convincing friends doesn't happen over night. It takes more effort than some are willing to invest. Making your arguments concise will help. If connecting to people is important then be worthy of their friendship. Some people believe they are helping you by encouraging you to be more independent.
Say this stuff to yourself, read it, re-read it, put it away for a couple weeks, a couple months, a couple years, read it again, edit it, then only post it if you love how enlightening it is.
First, I am somewhat new to Objectivism. Atlas Shrugged had been on my reading list for years but the monstrous size of it had scared me off for a bit.Atlas Shrugged is just the tip of the iceberg. Being afraid of the requirement of your effort is not a good sign.
Questions are challenges for to you to seek the answers. At the moment I am interested in exploring some answers, but I have a million other things I could be doing. It is of great value for you go get answers. It is not of great value for other people to spend their time answering questions that have already been answered.
Part of me fears after reading tens of thousands of more pages that they will still be unanswered, or I feared with too much reading i'd simply train myself to repeat the official answer having trained myself to ignore the cases where the philosophy doesn't seem to work perfectly.You have to improve the value of your judgement. Ayn Rand had unanswered questions.... where do you think she got the answers? She was still searching herself for answers right up until her death. It is a process, not a finish line.
It's not fear of devils advocate, its spending too much time on concepts we already get.
Another part of my reason for posting before reading everything is to keep a record of my own beliefs at the time to try and figure out if when and how they change and why.This will make people avoid you, or try to push you out.
At first I tried to put alot of arguments in one post, and was told to separate it up. I then made a bunch of separate posts and was accused of spamming the board. I only have intermittent internet access a few times per month, so I felt a need to post all my arguments at once in a shotgun approach hoping some of them would yield fruit when I checked back in a month.You aren't the first to do this. Your impatience implies that you don't have time to consider the responses anyway.
You Shouldn't expect people to sift through so much. You can prioritize your reading list by prioritizing the questions you have that are most important to you.
Its human nature to want to find a more efficient way of acquiring information and effect solutions.
You have to focus on doing all of this for yourself first. Objectivism doesn't owe you something for your appreciation.
Some individuals who are attracted to Objectivism seem to do so because they lack the communication skills, tact, or desire necessary to function productively with other people. Some Objectivists are elitist, they will push you to rise to the challenge or get out of the way.
You might want to consider changing your member name, it makes it hard to take you seriously.
"If you do it by your own choice, and if its not your primary aim in life, and if you don't regard it as a moral virtue, on those conditions its fine to help people if you want to." -Ayn Rand
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How can you possibly be unsure?
At least the answer is perfectly clear.
Effective communication requires tact.
I realize I need to be more concise when communicating in these forums.
As Eiuol said, I am sure it isn't Romantic Realism.
I know my work expresses some of my sense of life.
I am wondering if Objectivists or individual people here would find value in my work.
I would prefer to sell work to individualists rather than collectivists.
I am unsure as to whether this is a place I can grow as an artist.
I would agree there isn't enough discussion about art. It is too important to ignore.The liberals/socialists who run Deviant Art have a nurturing approach to artists. They allow a lot of really terrible work as a part of the process of developing the craft. The accounts I have heard of Ayn Rand's childhood seemed to be a creatively nurturing environment.
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I make art. The art world seems to be dominated by collectivists. Professionally I am trying to find my way. I am not sure if I want to support galleries or make money off of collectivists organizations. Then I think if I pull money from them to fund my own plans it could be worth it.
In the last couple months I have been putting my work up on the 'Deviant Art' website. There are 80,000 artists posting their work and reacting to each other on the site and I receive a great deal of praise and interest from them for my work. The praise mostly comes from people who are emotionally driven. I often praise and attempt to communicate with other Artists when I am interested in seeing what their potential might produce. I use the journal to talk about what has motivated me creatively. I have a gallery of my own work, and a gallery of favorites that I have compiled after looking through thousands of images from other artists favorites.
The cons of the site are that the Administration is predominantly Liberal, and continually feature and promote artists who fall in line with their political agendas while some times censoring those who don't. They allow anyone to post so the site is bombarded with 13 year old cartoon sketches.
The name 'Deviant Art' implies vampires and fetish, but it also implies (the reason I finally decided to join) a way to market or sell art outside of the traditional gallery system. At the moment my work is only open to view and comment; I haven't decided to sell anything yet.
I came to the Objectivism Online forum a couple years ago because of my love for Ayn Rand. I don't get the satisfaction from these Visual Arts threads that I get from her novels. I wasn't compelled to return here, though I often thought about it. Maybe I wasn't feeling confident enough in my own appraisal of my work to withstand the onslaught of dozens of non-art-making critics expressing their dislike. As I saw happen to several artists who posted their work here. To me the lack of activity in the Visual Arts Threads is a testament to some repellent forces to the creative spark that I would like to abate.
I am trying to understand Ayn Rands Aesthetics, but it is still a floating abstraction to me. I am not sure if my work lives up to her definition of what art is. I am wondering if my art could be of value to some of the 'Individuals' who also value Ayn Rand's philosophy. Will it diminish my individuality to align my art making with Romantic Realism?
The main point I want to make is this... I can go to Deviant Art to get praise, market myself, admire and learn from other artists, make friends, give advice, or I can come here and do what? What exactly is this visual arts forum for? Could this become or is there a place where individualist artists thrive?
My gallery at Deviant Art: http://tym-benn.deviantart.com/gallery/
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Stories like this place a symbolic marker in my heart for the efforts of my life to counterbalance the ignorance of the past.
I want to be a part of the change as great minds are less hindered by barbarism.
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Why is there a wanting of a larger sculpture - to what end? what is 'wrong' with this as is, sizewise?
Size communicates a symbolic meaning. When a work is life size it represents the whole man. The miniaturized version is inspiring, but doesn't have the same impact. Size also communicates the artists confidence in the value of their own work. It is a greater investment of time, money and effort to create. Larger work is more expensive and attracts a more elite group of collectors. The work has to be of great quality to sell in a higher stakes market.
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The opera house is an incredible monument, but it's construction is a testament to the powers that be encroaching on private projects, and turning them into something abhorrent.
The invention of the wheel is rudimentary to us now. The pyramids, the Great Wall of China, and the Taj Mahal were built with slave labor. The Colosseum was used for the entertainment of men killing each other. I believe the history of these places make the piece more complex and profound, man learning from the mistakes and triumphs of the past, creating something as profound as possible in spite of the circumstances, and continuing to move forward.
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David Lynch's creative work contrasts the darkest aspects of the human psyche with the transformation of innocence into the strength it takes to overcome evil. Isabella Rossellini was a major muse of his for over 6 years. His work often symbolizes things that are churning under the surface of what we see. He claims to direct the darkness into his work but avoids it in his personal life. David Lynch holds an intense devotion to the value of human potential.
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If you are unable to find the poster you are looking for, you could write the quote yourself on any poster of the New York City skyline.
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Beautiful and inspiring work.
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The IQ tests I have seen generally seem to be filled with trick questions that are answered better by slowing down and really paying attention, rather than making assumptions about what you first think its saying. Many of the mathematical equations don't t really need to be added up... to see if the answer is odd or even (if there are an odd number of odd numbers the answer will be odd).
A person can get very good at answering IQ test questions without actually becoming smarter by using short cuts. An insatiable curiosity and dedicated attention will improve a persons intelligence a great deal more than knowing what their score is.
I am not as interested in how I rate compared to other people as I am in understanding the many ways people think and organize their attention. I like looking at the concept of IQ as a way to look at my own cognitive style and improve how I go about my thought process.
I think that IQ tests should have a lot more questions (1,000 at least) in order to get a better perspective on the mind. An IQ test of the caliber that is in my imagination would actually make you smarter just by taking it. In order to see such a thing come to fruition I would have to study every IQ test I could find, study human psychology, learning, epistemology, extending attention span... among other things... directing them to the idea of the ultimate IQ test.
But... I have dozens of other ideas I want to pursue that are more important to me at the moment.
Its strange to think that a psychologist is necessary to help analyze intelligence, it seems that what ever information a psychologist could impart would be just as accessible from books.
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A sweater suggests a comforting warmth to bolster her against the elements that could drain her energy. White is the color in the most danger of being stained, showing the sharpest contrast with the possibility of having blood spattered onto it, drawing the most attention in the darkness of night. Having the confidence to wear it in dangerous situations is subconsciously confusing and intimidating to enemies.
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I hope DarkReaver will return to this thread to comment more on how close this work is to his highest ideals, or if any of this discussion has given him a sense for where he can choose to go with future artwork.
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Ayn did seem to adopt a less tragic and more heroic victory stance in her later work, though the pain of her history seems to have had a personal influence on everything she chose to do throughout her life.
To relate this back to painting, it seems that a priority in Objectivist Aesthetics is for the creator of the work to value it as high as their other values. As far as Capitalist aspects go, if the artist wants to make a profit the work should communicate a value to potential buyers that is at least equivalent to the time it took to make the work and the value the creator places on it.
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I believe that Ayn Rand understood that some people would not like her choice to end her book with her hero's death. It was a classic individualist choice to end it the way she wanted to end it, regardless of the opinions of others.
There are probably stories she has read and loved that had happy endings.
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We all have the chance to describe how happy/tragic endings influence us personally. You make it abundantly clear how you only like happy endings DragonMaci. My response is to my perception of Aesthetics, and not to antagonize you or convince you of anything you don't want to be convinced of. I appreciate that we disagree, it is a wonderful world to have differing views.
The reaction against such a situation is shown strongly in DragonMaci's position. That feeling may be exactly what she wants you to feel, because she sees a value in making you feel so intensely.I should have written this part better, I did not mean to imply that Ayn Rand wants to make DragonMaci feel one way or another. I was trying to sum up the perception of the common/natural human desire for happy endings, and Ayn Rand's decision to go against the grain in order to make a point that some people value.
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In regard to Darkreaver's responses about his art. If you haven't made art in 3 years, the question that seems relevant to me is 'Why haven't you been inspired to make work since these last pieces?' Your curiosity about rules of Aesthetics seems to be based more on an urge in you now to make art that has relevance to your current state of mind. You seem to be wondering where to go from the last place you left off. Do you think that Objectivist rules of Aesthetics will expand or confine your personal art style?
In regard to We the Living
In making art there is a power to influence the audience. It seems that Ayn made the decision to kill Kira with the full intention of causing pain in the reaction of the reader. Why? What was her ultimate intention in causing such a situation to happen in her story? Any Rand had no lack of controversy in her works. She understood that the intensity and contrast of repulsion had motive power to it. Such a shock to the system has staying power, affecting people on deeper levels. Taking the emotions on a ride like that will attach stronger memory connections to the point of the story. Putting the reader in mortal fear of their own ability to loose everything they value. The reaction against such a situation is shown strongly in DragonMaci's position. That feeling may be exactly what she wants you to feel, because she sees a value in making you feel so intensely.
It depends on what you see as ultimate success. Is the happy ending of a Fictional story truly a success? It does not necessarily guarantee that the reader will be as determined to succeed in their own endeavors. If you know the hero will win from the beginning won't you question on some level if the hero was ever in any real danger at all?
Just because your characters are guaranteed a happy ending doesn't mean that you are. You could die in a car crash tomorrow, or a terrorist bombing. In a way happy endings can offer a false sense of security.
Ayn's own life was filled with real people who had succumbed to the death of their sense of life. She said that it was as close to an autobiography as she would ever come to writing. Kira's death can be seen as an homage to the tragedy of all of the people and potentials Ayn Rand saw perish first hand due to the circumstances of communism. It also symbolizes to me a reflection of what would have happened to Ayn if she hadn't escaped. Is Kira's death any less tragic than the death of Ayn's friends and family? Every day of Ayn's life seems to be a heroic claim to her sense of life, the very fact that she was able to publish her story from this side of the iron curtain is a testament to the success of the book. In a way she had to kill Kira, because she could never be that girl trapped in Russia again.
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This is a great thread for the exploration of history, and new technology. I used to think space elevators were more science fiction, than actual science. It is interesting to me now to do some research online to see how practical they can become.
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The view alone wouldn't justify the exhorbitant amount of money early space tourism will cost.
If the cost of space tourism were considered an investment rather than an indulgence it would bear more weight in the minds of potential ticket buyers. There are some objections to the term Space 'Tourism', as though it alludes to a superfluous experience.
The Russian Space Agency has been successful in charging $20 million for personal flights, Virgin Galactic is beginning with $200,000 in 2009 and planning to bring the cost down to $100,000 in subsequent years. When Virgin Galactic's most likely competitors (including Rocketplane Kistler, Space Adventures, and Benson Space Company) jump into the fray prices should continue to drop.
The influence of the view from space on the minds of those who are already reserving their tickets will depend on their personal beliefs. It has been described as an awe inspiring and consciousness expanding encounter by those who have experienced it. I believe such an experience has a lasting lifelong influence on the hearts and minds of individuals. Creatively it stands as a symbol of achievement and an expansion of the scope and possibility of existence. This kind of experience fuels a great deal of motive power in the lives of those who experience it, and also in the minds of those who can only imagine it. The kind of people who are willing and able to pay already understand (and profit) from the pull of attraction space travel offers.
The future of private space travel depends on the duration of successful flights, with safe landings, to influence the number of willing participants.
I walk the Line
in Visual Arts
Posted
This has been the most valuable response for me so far. I will contemplate it repeatedly.