Jump to content
Objectivism Online Forum

Simulacra

Regulars
  • Posts

    16
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Contact Methods

  • Website URL
    http://
  • ICQ
    0

Previous Fields

  • Country
    Not Specified
  • State (US/Canadian)
    Not Specified
  • Relationship status
    No Answer
  • Sexual orientation
    No Answer
  • Copyright
    Copyrighted

Simulacra's Achievements

Novice

Novice (2/7)

0

Reputation

  1. I do not believe that "we are poor because they are rich and vice versa, that history is a successful conspiration of evil against good in which the evil always win and we always lose (and he is ALWAYS amongst the poor victims and good losers)" I never said that, never talked about America's imperialism or Europe's colonialism like a marxist would. We can both be rich. And when I think of culture I don't completely think: "What I know, I learned in life, not in books, that's why my culture isn't bookish, it's vital." All I discussed was about theories and books and finalized in inviting anyone, including yourself, to show you poverty cause it's obvious you haven't felt it. I'm not saying that if you live in a third world country you'll understand that it's not simply numbers, trust me, the rich ladies drinking tea in expensive neighborhood here don't know anything about poverty. You can be very intelligent and be blind as yourself. No te preocupes, segui asi, no es tu hijo muriendose. Aparte, vos no podes hacer nada para salvarlo... Estoy de acuerdo que es culpa de los gobiernos y de la ignorancia, por eso digo, demosle educacion. Nada mas.
  2. You believe you would be where you are financially if you would have been born in a Favela? This is the premise of Objectivism that I began with and wanted to discuss. You wouldn't have ever read Ayn Rand much less have any incentive to be an "individual hero." You all need to travel and really live in different parts of the world, see poverty first hand, live in or by it. I still have a long way to go. Five thousand years of History and Culture will teach us something that we haven't already learned in are small existence, lets not think that the US is the whole world. That "since it's the pinnacle of evolution of the mind and of reason, why be anywhere else?" like i think most americans view as the truth when they go on vacation or think about the rest of the world. This is not the case. Proposed absolute truths (those who supposedly have all the answers) like marxism, religions or Objectivism are the same as science paradigms (Kuhn's "the Structure of Scientific revolutions"). You're constructing on false premises which are not put into to practice in the real world. Remember, the USA is not the whole world. I lived there. Every thing else is "exotic" or not "evolutionized". I realized how false this was after living a year outside the country (it's been 10 years now). I think the smartest one can be is to be open and question one's most profound ideas. That's what I did when I came to this forum. But you're arguments ended in the nonsense of saying that you are superior human being, that you are capable of molding your life independently of your circumstance. So, you can say: "Yeah, he's irrational" and anything you want to please yourself. About your quote of Ayn Rand, It is not all black or white, you should give part of your money so the hundreds of children who are dying as we speak can be offered to have the education (and the health to fulfill it) to see whether he will take advantage of what his education gave him like you, or turn out having a petty existence. And it's not even that simple. There are infinite factors that make a person who he or she is. Yes, we should have the will power to overcome anything, but tell that to the kid who just died of hunger. You think he didn't try? He did, until he died. It's his fathers fault for having him? There is NO education when you're that poor. So, as we speak, in the Asian, African and Latin American countries, well over 500 million people are living in what the World Bank has called "absolute poverty"; one out of every eight children under the age of twelve in the U.S. goes to bed hungry every night. every year 15 million children die of hunger; for the price of one missile, a school full of hungry children could eat lunch every day for 5 years. So, please don't come, like Ayn Rand, and reduce the world's poverty to "it's the parents fault for having them" and let them all die on a good conscious with total negligence. If any of you ever come down to Argentina, I'll receive you in open arms and show you what I mean. We only live once, lets not fool ourselves. Truth doesn't solely lie in books or debates, reality persuades a little better. Good Night and Good Luck. email: [email protected]
  3. You believe you would be where you are financially if you would have been born in a Favela? This is the premise of Objectivism that I began with and wanted to discuss. You wouldn't have ever read Ayn Rand much less have any incentive to be an "individual hero." You all need to travel and really live in different parts of the world, see poverty first hand, live in or by it. I still have a long way to go. Five thousand years of History and Culture will teach us something that we haven't already learned in are small existence, lets not think that the US is the whole world. That "since it's the pinnacle of evolution of the mind and of reason, why be anywhere else?" like i think most americans view as the truth when they go on vacation or think about the rest of the world. This is not the case. Proposed absolute truths (those who supposedly have all the answers) like marxism, religions or Objectivism are the same as science paradigms (Kuhn's "the Structure of Scientific revolutions"). You're constructing on false premises which are not put into to practice in the real world. Remember, the USA is not the whole world. I lived there. Every thing else is "exotic" or not "evolutionized". I realized how false this was after living a year outside the country (it's been 10 years now). I think the smartest one can be is to be open and question one's most profound ideas. That's what I did when I came to this forum. But you're arguments ended in the nonsense of saying that you are superior human being, that you are capable of molding your life independently of your circumstance. So, you can say: "Yeah, he's irrational" and anything you want to please yourself. About your quote of Ayn Rand, It is not all black or white, you should give part of your money so the hundreds of children who are dying as we speak can be offered to have the education (and the health to fulfill it) to see whether he will take advantage of what his education gave him like you, or turn out having a petty existence. And it's not even that simple. There are infinite factors that make a person who he or she is. Yes, we should have the will power to overcome anything, but tell that to the kid who just died of hunger. You think he didn't try? He did, until he died. It's his fathers fault for having him? There is NO education when you're that poor. So, as we speak, in the Asian, African and Latin American countries, well over 500 million people are living in what the World Bank has called "absolute poverty"; one out of every eight children under the age of twelve in the U.S. goes to bed hungry every night. every year 15 million children die of hunger; for the price of one missile, a school full of hungry children could eat lunch every day for 5 years. So, please don't come, like Ayn Rand, and reduce the world's poverty to "it's the parents fault for having them" and let them all die on a good conscious with total negligence. If any of you ever come down to Argentina, I'll receive you in open arms and show you what I mean. We only live once, lets not fool ourselves. Truth doesn't solely lie in books or debates, reality persuades a little better. Good Night and Good Luck. email: [email protected]
  4. OK I have to go. But I don't want to turn this into that scene in the fountainhead where Howard tries to debate against the board of that bank and cannot. I liked the ideas of Zip and QuoVadis for instance, so I would appreciate it if only you two or 2046 (if he feels I evade him) to debate. Read the last posts I wrote and follow my objections to Objectivism: there should be taxes and if you are starving or in extreme poverty 99% of people won't get out of that. I'll continue tomorrow with anyone who's willing cause I'm guessing Quo Vadis thinks I'm irrational. Take into mind what happened between Ayn Rand and Nathaniel Branden. Branden disagreed with some of Rand's ideas and especially her constant use of a pseudo argument, thinking and calling everything she doesn't agree with "irrational". Yes, she would justify many, but not all. Why? Yes, because a debate is never completely rational, it would take a lifetime. So, I would like to listen to your ideas to see if they tell me I'm wrong, but patience.
  5. Listen, don't get upset, I wasn't screeming, I was laughing. But I understand that virtual communication isn't the best. You're right in saying that I don't know where you came from. But I intend to show that MOST people that have opportunities (a good -not rich- financial background) wouldn't have gotten were they are without those opportunities. But again I appologize if I offended you, I really wish to debate this with you, cause you haven't answered my questions. Thank you.
  6. My needs, which aren't mine, but there's (poor people), should be fulfilled in a basic form like they're done in the US. There should be taxes but not extraordinary, just enough to give people basic needs (which means not welfare but institutions like schools and universities, hospitals, roads) that they can choose to use if they need it. Please don't evade my question: do you agree that you wouldn't have earned your money if you had been born in the Favela of Brazil? YOU, NOT Fictional Howard Roark or Gail Wynand, etc.
  7. Ok guys, I have to go to dinner, it's 9:10 pm here PLEASE leave your posts and answers. And would appreciate if only a couple who are informed of Objectivism's ideas would take the debate cause if not it's crazy (and we have lives to get back to but thank you very much for debating and I'll come back tomorrow and answer everything. And trust me, I was enchanted with Ayn Rand's ideas at an earlier age but I hit certain realities that an absolute ideology (that's what I call Objectivism) is not constructed upon. I'm definitely open for you to convince me, but first we need to lay down our positions.
  8. NONONO, I think the US HAS A VERY JUST SOCIETY! I THINK AYN RAND'S IDEAL SOCIETY WOULDN'T BE JUST. IN THE US THERE ARE TAXES! Of course I feel many countries in Europe are more just but the US of course has a better ppolitical system than third world countries.
  9. PLEASE EVERYONE READ THIS (CAUSE IT's BECOMING IMPOSSIBLE TO ANSWER EVERYTHING SINCE SOME OF YOU ARE POSTING THE SAME IDEAS). 2046: YOU and Your friends would not be the same as the US government. Go research on america's political system (elections, three powers, each control each other, individual rights, etc etc). This is the government that Ayn Rand loved so much (of course not as much as her ideal state, but never the less loved), so I wouldn't ridicule it. Quo Vadis: you have to see that you are where you are mainly because of where you were born. I agree that it's not responsible for poor people to have kids that they can't 'afford' and its bad that you should have to support them through taxes. But you have to see that the reason a lot of poor people have to many kids is because of the lack of education, the education YOU received and they never could. Please reed my first post again. You were able to work for your money because of your birth condition. More than 50% of the world don't have that same condition. So I say give basic necessities to those you can get them like us. Again, understand that the US's poverty is not like the real poverty in the world.
  10. haha, everything's not so black and white. I should explain myself better. I'm talking about third world and America's public education. I believe that way out of those systems are more towards Europe's Social Democracies. There should definitely be both private and public education. I was giving a hypothetical situation for a poor person who can't send their child to a private school. Since I live in Argentina, I did high school in a private school and but am doing college in the University of Buenos Aires (public) which is much better than the private ones. I also know many kids from Yale and NYU and have informed myself about those schools, my sister attended classes in the second and my father went to Yale and UCLA. They aren't much better... the government should give the option of a good public school like there are in Europe (we can look at France's education system). Also, I went to the second best highschool here which is subsidized, the best one is public. In this school and at the University of Buenos Aires you don't pay ANYTHING (not like America's "public" schools).
  11. haha, everything's not so black and white. I should explain myself better. I'm talking about third world and America's public education. I believe that way out of those systems are more towards Europe's Social Democracies. There should definitely be both private and public education. I was giving a hypothetical situation for a poor person who can't send their child to a private school. Since I live in Argentina, I did high school in a private school and but am doing college in the University of Buenos Aires which is much better than the private ones. I also know many kids from Yale and NYU and have informed myself about those schools, my sister attended classes in the second and my father went to Yale. They aren't much better... the government should give the option of a good public school like there are in Europe. Also, I went to the second best highschool here which is subsidized, the best one is public. In this school and at the University of Buenos Aires you don't pay ANYTHING (not like America's "public schools").
  12. Oh, So you see your definition of Utopia is mistaken (it is not necessarily an impossible society). We would have to define man's individual rights. I believe in private property and private competition but I also believe that since YOU and I could have been born (what you in a detached way call) "poor and hungry" government needs to assure that we can get out of extreme poverty if we try basic things like going to school (a kid only can do basic things, you see?)
  13. Yes, government has a cost to give education and health, but the poorest person doesn't have to pay as many taxes as the richest. the poorest don't pay really (besides small percentage of things you buy at the store) because you can imagine they can't afford paying anything significant and they do go to public school with $3 a day. [Edit] What I'm saying is that I think richer people should pay taxes more taxes than poorer people so that we all have the basic opportunities to create a just society. Of course I'm not talking about 80% or anything like that. Many (or most) rich or non rich people were born that way, do they have more rights? they accessed a good education because of that. I agree that Socialism tends towards monopolies. And I don't think capitalism tends towards monopolies but capitalists do. You see? But 2046 already said it. The Ayn Rand perfect society won't take everyone out of poverty and agrees that most can't do it by themselves. We understand eachother about what poverty means: not american ghettos (although that situation is bad), I'm talking about slums like the ones there are in any third world country. [Edit] I would like for you to tell me if Objectivism believes that premise (Anyone can get out of their economic situation through will power, etc).
  14. That sad you're so closed minded. It seems like an excuse. Utopia: 2. (usually lowercase) an ideal place or state. 3. (usually lowercase) any visionary system of political or social perfection.
×
×
  • Create New...