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Everything posted by dream_weaver
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Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Since all knowledge came from that which has been perceived, . . . if you have not perceived it, how can you have knowledge of it? -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Logic is not 'out there', logic is a method the mind/consciousness must perform. The 'out there' is the given, it is the data which must be converted by the mind. In a concept of entity - dog, cat, house, etc., we can readily confirm with one another we are using the same words to refer to the same objects. In a concept of motion - running, walking, jumping, we can indicate the entity performing the motions, again, confirming we are using the same words to refer to the same actions. Even the concepts of materials are relatively simple to validate. As we move further from the perceptual, when we begin to abstract from the abstractions, the concepts begin to have more complex relationships, making them more difficult to just point to what we mean by animal, habitation, capitalism, etc. Universal is not 'out there'. Each concept is an integration based on a relationship between consciousness and existence. Each individual must perform this integration for themselves. In this sense, you could consider it 'subjective'. As in the concepts of entities we can point to what we mean, it is pretty simple to establish agreement. In order to establish agreement with more abstract concepts - the method of concept formation has to be addressed in order to ensure that the same referents, and referents to other referents, are the same. It is this method that allows us to 'ostensibly' establish agreement. The 'universal' is the method of maintaining the the relationship of the concept with the similarities observed in usually several percepts. As you move into the arena of adverbs, adjectives, prepositions, pronouns and conjunctions - these contain concepts as well, many to do with how to relate concepts to other concepts in communication. It is in the concepts that 'reason' and 'logic' are 'stored'. To try and divorce a concept from this is to generate floating abstractions, stolen concepts, invalid concepts etc. To state you care about the 'ability to know' universals requires the 'location and source' to do so. The ability to know the universal, is the ability to trace it back to its source(s). -
How to create temperatures below absolute zero Objectivist who may have relied on this scientific assertion to tie the concept of absolutes to the science of physics may have to seek another example now. Scientists Find 200 Sextillion More Stars in the Sky And just in case you were trying to count, or lost count somewhere along the way - this might help illustrate why the identification of premises, or in this case, assumptions, could make a slight difference in the outcome.
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Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
By the same method used to extend the concept of man beyond the perceptual, except now you are applying it to number instead. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
If you take the concept of 'man', we started with Mom, Dad, Aunt, Uncle. Later we added the Clerk, Police Officer, and Teacher. From the perceptual, you see a 'man' that you have not previously observed, and recognize the similarity to 'man' that you established the concept formed from Mom, Dad, etc. You see another 'man' you have not seen before. You repeat the process. At some point you induce that there are 'man' that you have not perceived that are included in the universal 'man'. You continue to perceive new instances of 'man' deduce that they are similar to the other instances you have observed. The perceptual in this case is the perception of a previously unperceived 'man'. This observation of reality permits us to expand beyond the perceptual, using the perceptual to extend to unobserved members. Questioning the Objectivist position on universals? You have a tendency to try and 'create positions on things' for others. Jacob86 appears to be questioning the Objectivist position on universals. Plasmatic, Grames, New Buddah and others have been patiently trying to help you understand. -
The dangerous allure of guilt
dream_weaver replied to SapereAude's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Is it the guilt that is so attractive? It is certainly pervasive. Reason is not generally formally taught, it is at best absorbed from the Aristotilian influence that is still around us in the form of common sense. Stemming from this is a more foreboding sense of purposelessness. Without purpose, inner conflicts usually arise. If the source of the conflict cannot be identified, a gnawing sense of disease arises. Unanswered, it is like a void, to filled by something or anything. Feeling defenseless against an unknown source of guilt heightens the susceptibility and receptiveness to something or anything which can serve to identify it. As reason and purpose are prerequisites to self-esteem, this may certainly be viewed as a shortcut. As to unearned guilt? Substituting actual unearned guilt, such as the "White Europeans" mentioned earlier, for an earned guilt, if indeed this is the case, at best can only camouflage it thus becoming more difficult to later detect and correct. edited for spelling. Great question! -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
The ball rolled when Jacob86 pushed it. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
I caught the part where you stated "I DO NOT care about the subjective discovery and formation of concepts" so I'm a little unclear if you implied the same thing that I inferred, or if you implied something different than I inferred. You see, I don't know if you are subjectively saying what you mean, or if perhaps you are subjectively meaning what you say. It reads to me that words are mere arbitrary social constructs. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
I have to hand it to you. Few people out there could have stated as succinctly what you have here. Considering that the objective, systematic ordering of truth is 'stored' if you will 'in concepts', separating the 'subjective discovery and formation of concepts' (truth criteria) identifies it quite Objectively. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
No, and no I do not agree. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Mere observation is not the only reason. Consciousness is an active process of differentiation and integration. Again, grasping that 2+2=4 is a process. A noble act, is an action. It is establishing and maintaining the tie (relationship) between the word, via definition to invoke the concept which was formed by the relationship between consciousness and existence to the existent(s) which the concept was abstracted from. I do not know if you believe that 2+2=4 strictly based on observation or not. 2+2=4 whether it is observed or not, providing that conceptual consciousness maintains the relationship between the word 'two' and the concept '||' which is related to the observations of 'A A', 'cat cat', 'dog dog', 'house house' or abstract it more fully as the 'relationship between a group of entities and one of its members taken as a unit'. Memorizing a formula may work for a parrot to be able to repeat it, but does the parrot conceptualize the crucial differences that tie its 'words' to the 'concepts' to the 'existents' which validate them? Well, since the metaphysical is the given, and our concepts have to be integrated into the words we create to reference them, 'A is A' is true because of what we stipulate what the words mean by relating them to the concepts we percieved from the existents that we observe are there. Yes. Reducing abstractions from abstractions through the web of often intertangled relationships between the conceptual and ultimately to the perceptual level, helps to understand the process of reasoning, I have heard. -
Bill Gates Vs Steve Jobs Who’s the "Better" Person
dream_weaver replied to d'Anconia's topic in Ethics
When altruism is the measure in ethics, it is easy to see why the media's balance scale tilts the way it does. What was more disappointing to me was to discover that Pixar has been acquired by Disney. With the exception of Wall-E, their productions had a pretty good 'sense of life' over-all. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Jacob, that is the point. It is not that every instance a application of logic requires the full tracing back to the perceptual level every time it is invoked. Rather, it is that all knowledge is reducible to the perceptual level, in the validation of concepts, and the proof of propositons. The law of identity is grasped from inducing, or conceptually grasping the common principle observed in common with all entities. They (the entitites) are what they are, each and every one of them (the entities, that is). Entity is Entity. A is A. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Conceptualism: The theory that universals can be said to exist, but only as concepts in the mind. or Conceptualism is a doctrine in philosophy intermediate between nominalism and realism that says universals exist only within the mind and have no external or substantial reality. -
If a "right," in Ayn Rand's definition, "is a moral principle defining and sanctioning a man's freedom of action in a social context," it is not the tutors failing to teach that cheap, free, or even education for that matter are not 'rights', but a failure to identify and teach what rights are. If the students and tutors want to regain their rights, they will have to begin with the discovery of morality.
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Delta Airline Workers Reject Unionization
dream_weaver replied to SapereAude's topic in Domestic United States Politics
The union cannot pursuade the workers to land on their collectivist runway. Since there are no provisions to decertify the union if adopted, it is in the union's interest to keep flying this past the workers. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Jacob86, 21 pages under the heading of "Argument for the existence of God" - 'Please convince me that this is false (IF indeed it is)' does not imply agreement with a Primacy of Existence position. Stating you wish to be 'convinced' of something as being false(if indeed it is, suggest you do not a firm conviction of this yourself), runs afoul of the onus of proof lie on the individual who asserts the 'existence of God', not on demonstrating that such is not the case. Your desire to make the distinction of using Mom, Dad, Grandma, Grandpa, Uncle Joe, Aunt Mary, the cashier at the grocery store, the clerk at the gas station as the perceptual data you used to integrate the concept 'man' from - later deducing that your local minister, the police officer and the President of the United States of America are further examples of 'man' - and then posing a question that reeks of the aroma of "There is a claim that there are 6.5 billion instances of 'man' on the planet - does my concept of 'man' refer to only the 8 individuals that I used to form the concept and the few instances I've included since formulating it" is an attempt to grasp someone else's 'world view'? I am not persuaded. Godspeed in your pursuit. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
How is this different the the "problem of universals" Peikoff pointed out that Rand resolved on page 89 of Objectivism: The Philosophy of Ayn Rand? How is this different the the "problem of universals" Peikoff pointed out that Rand resolved on page 89 of Objectivism: The Philosophy of Ayn Rand? How is this different the the "problem of universals" Peikoff pointed out that Rand resolved on page 89 of Objectivism: The Philosophy of Ayn Rand? I think Grames is covering that with you just fine. In what sense is Peikoff referring to Rand as having solved the "problem of universals"? He draws a contrast of Miss Rand's solution, contrasting it with which historic views? If you were honestly, intellectually pursuing a grasp and comprehension of the subject matter, your continual circling around and trying to raise a slightly different context of your same confusions might lead us to believe we may be the wrong source to deliver you a response that fits what you want to hear. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
To what was Leonard Peikoff referring? Classical martian, or perhaps Divine Revelation? -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Concepts refer to the existents from which they were derived. 2+2=4 when you are using number to count number with. Because concepts correspond to reality. When you use the concepts, you are implicitly appealing to the data of sense. They are true because knowledge is contextual, the context by which it was established logically and heirarchially, corresponding the concept(s) to the data of sense in reality from which they were derived. With all your referencing to 'universal' you might consider reading the material leading up to this, where Leonard Peikoff says: -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Actually, the Law of Identity is grasped conceptually (where do concepts come from again. Yes that's right, hence they trace back to the perceptual.) 2 qts. of water mixed with 2 qts. of ethyl alcohol yield 3.86 qts. of liquid, at 15.56°C. What is 'truth'? It is precisely the data of sense that permits you to grasp and understand. You used the data of sense to grasp, comprehend, and understand "square" and "circle" and the as an aside, attach a definition to the term to 'jog your memory' if you will to recollect what data of sense gave rise to them. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
I don't understand how your examples do not rely on the data of sense for validation. So we experience sense data first to determine it is true, but we didn't rely on date of sense to validate it originally? Duh. We used the data of sense to validate it already. What do these propositions refer to? So we use the data of sense to grasp what "square" and "circle" are, but after we grasp what they are, we didn't use the data of sense to grasp what they are? It is taken from: The Journals of Ayn Rand Part 4 - Atlas Shrugged 11 - The Mind On Strike "Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it." The Analytic-Synthetic Dichotomy is not valid here. -
Argument for the existence of God
dream_weaver replied to Jacob86's topic in Metaphysics and Epistemology
Other than the data of sense, what is another way to validate our concepts? I am beginning to get the sense that reason is not automatic here. -
J.R.R. Tolkien's Lord of the Rings is about the only book I've ever read twice, save Rand's material. Moby Dick, War and Peace, Dune, Chronicles of Narnia, Pilgrim's Progress, Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe were all memorable. I do not recall by whom they were written, the stories that told the tales of Greek Mythology stir pleasant recollections of pre-teen readings.
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I've seen the rape and pillage ending in an e-mail as I recall. I suppose, as one of Aesop's Fables, the copyright may have expired by now.