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Are Violent Video Games Unethical?

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brandonk2009

Violent Video Games: Ethical or Not?  

45 members have voted

  1. 1. are Violent Video Games Unethical?

    • Yes
      4
    • No
      39


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I was on a school trip, riding in a bus to play in our pep band. A group of kids started talking about violent video games. I was surprised to find so many kids expressing their opinions.

We never really came up with an answer.

One good point a kid came up with was that violence on video games is becoming more and more realistic. For example, the Wii has violent video games where you actually mimic beating a person with their motion sensitive controllers.

Are violent video games unethical? And if they are, how does that translate into a political position?

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Are violent video games unethical?

I said no mostly because the question is too broad. You need to provide a more specific context.

Politically speaking, unless video games are somehow violating someone's rights, the government should have no part affect on them.

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The answer would also depend on whether the violence in the video game was depicted as serving a good purpose or an evil one. And a whole lot of other context like that. If the question is if video games that have violence in them are as such unethical because they contain "violence" - as if that alone is supposed to be unethical, on a blanket basis - then I would say no: "violent video games" qua violence as such are not unethical.

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I said yes because the options were limited to yes and no, so I had to pick a particular context. Sorry if you didn't like my context: that's what makes poll-construction so deucedly difficult. I would say a game is unethical if a person acts immorally in playing the game. A problem arises when a person allows the game context to carry over to the non-game world and, for example, becomes less inclined to being revulsed at mayhem. It would be immoral for a person to play violent video games if it affected their personality in the direction of Seung-Hui Cho.

That would translate into the political position that violent video games should be outlawed, if you believe that the function of government is to relieve all people of taking responsibility for themselves including their own happiness. But that is an immoral view.

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David,

Do you have any evidence for your theory (and one I've seen many people declare) that supports your idea that people can somehow 'carry over the context' when looking at the real world - is there any proof that people watching violent films or playing violent video games can actually even possibly become desensitised to violence in some shape or form?

I know you have access to a wide range of journals, and if you could point me in the direction of some articles which discuss this notion, with valid proof, I would be most grateful.

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Do you have any evidence for your theory (and one I've seen many people declare) that supports your idea that people can somehow 'carry over the context' when looking at the real world

Allow me to make a distinction if applicable. I think that many of the claims state that video games (or insert media here) DO influence children (or whoever) in a bad way necessarily as a opposed to what David said in saying that they can. I think the "can" claim is legitimate but the "do" claim is not. There are more than a few very easily influenced people in the world. I think the argument would really lie in the numbers (how many have been negatively affected) not in the possibility.

I know of several cases where (at the very least) the offenders (kids) claimed that they did X because they saw it or played it in Y. One of the more famous cases was where two young brothers were playing pro wrestling and one brother slammed a chair on his younger brother. If I recall correctly, the younger brother died. We had a local case many years back of a 'Dungeons and Dragons' killing. However, in many of these cases, the people involved had issues to begin with long before video games or Dungeons and Dragons had anything to do with it.

However, my original objection to the poll is that it is too broad to be of any real use.

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I was on a school trip, riding in a bus to play in our pep band. A group of kids started talking about violent video games. I was surprised to find so many kids expressing their opinions.

We never really came up with an answer.

One good point a kid came up with was that violence on video games is becoming more and more realistic. For example, the Wii has violent video games where you actually mimic beating a person with their motion sensitive controllers.

Are violent video games unethical? And if they are, how does that translate into a political position?

Play violence may be a useful cathartic. It could be an objectively harmless way of discharging one's violent urges. I do not see any violation of ethics in such games. Who is being beaten up? No one in real life.

Bob Kolker

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However, in many of these cases, the people involved had issues to begin with long before video games or Dungeons and Dragons had anything to do with it.

BINGO!

That is a very important point to emphasize. I think that this also includes their choice of art, whether it be music, literature, paintings...they can act as indicators, depending on the context.

Oh, btw, I voted YES.

I don't think about violent things in real life, so why the hell would I want to play a game that simulates it?? Violence means "physical force exerted for the purpose of violating, damaging, or abusing" or "abusive or unjust exercise of power"...I have no reason to play a game to act that out.

Edited by intellectualammo
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I don't think about violent things in real life, so why the hell would I want to play a game that simulates it?? Violence (which means "physical force exerted for the purpose of violating, damaging, or abusing" or "abusive or unjust exercise of power") is unethical/immoral/evil in those meanings in real life, so it is on canvas, on paper, and in games, IMO. (unless it is used for instructional or educational purposes)

I guess I think of violence differently, and I do as a matter of course think about violence quite a bit. I use it very little, but I have to occasionally meet violence with violence for defensive purposes. I consider my actions no less violent than the perpetrators (in some cases) but for a different purpose.

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Whether a child got his/her hands on a mature rated game and was effected by it or not does not make it unethical for an adult to play violent games Nor does it make it the governments right to prevent adults from buying it.

I've enjoyed violent games not because I'm sick or nihilistic but because of good realistic visuals, story, and/or gameplay. That does not make me unethical. I would not murder someone in real life.

Laws already exist to prevent children from buying violent games.

It says right on the box the game is rated M for 17 and older. It is the parents responsibility to know what they're buying their children when it comes to any form of media.

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I guess I think of violence differently, and I do as a matter of course think about violence quite a bit. I use it very little, but I have to occasionally meet violence with violence for defensive purposes. I consider my actions no less violent than the perpetrators (in some cases) but for a different purpose.

Yeah, I was changing my post when while you were replying, because I wasn't entirely sure if "violence" as such was considered initiation of force strictly, or also in retribution that it could be applicable. I think that in retaliation, it should not be considered violence, but I could be wrong, it's my take on it.

I've enjoyed violent games not because I'm sick or nihilistic but because of good realistic visuals, story, and/or gameplay. That does not make me unethical. I would not murder someone in real life.

Then why do it in a game? I don't understand that. Is it to satisfy some "violent urge" like what another poster said? How is it enjoyment for you? I'm just trying to broaden my understanding on your side of it, the gamer side of it.

Edited by intellectualammo
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Then why do it in a game? I don't understand that. Is it to satisfy some "violent urge" like what another poster said? How is it enjoyment for you? I'm just trying to broaden my understanding on your side of it, the gamer side of it.

It might be a non-injurious way of discharging anger. Better to discharge our nasty urges in a situation where real people will not be hurt. Have you never had the urge to break something? It is better to throw a virtual brick through a virtual window than to do it for real.

Bob Kolker

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Have you never had the urge to break something? It is better to throw a virtual brick through a virtual window than to do it for real.

But the thing of it is, is that you are wanting to do it either way. It's the why you are wanting to do it, that concerns me. I never act this way anymore, ever since I grew up (which took a while, mind you).

"The number one negative effect is they tend to inappropriately resolve anxiety by externalizing it. So when kids have anxiety, which they do, instead of soothing themselves, calming themselves, talking about it, expressing it to someone, or even expressing it emotionally by crying, they tend to externalize it. They can attack something, they can kick a wall, they can be mean to a dog or a pet."

or play video games...

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Then why do it in a game?

Your question seems to presume violence is a bad thing instead of considering the context in which violence might be necessary.

Violence is a part of some of the types of games I enjoy mainly because I like games about conflicts between good and evil. It's true that you can make less violent games (like Portal which I also like) that are equally intriguing, but they are far fewer on the market.

To some degree, violence is a part of my lifestyle because of my occupation. I view violence almost like a tool much like a hammer. I don't necessarily think that a person how likes violence in their games is does so because they have some need to vicariously experience it there instead of real life. However, the violence in games does not make me lose perspective of how evil it can be when inflicted upon the innocent.

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Your question seems to presume violence is a bad thing

We need to find a shared defintion of violence and stick with it then, because according to my two meanings of violence, those ones ARE bad/evil/immoral things.

Violence is a part of some of the types of games I enjoy mainly because I like games about conflicts between good and evil.

As a player, do you initiate the use of force in these games?

Edited by intellectualammo
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We need to find a shared defintion of violence and stick with it then, because according to my two meanings of violence, those ones ARE bad/evil/immoral things.

I recognize those among several definitions of the word. However, when I speak of violence, I'm referring to this; rough or injurious physical force, action, or treatment. I think this is consistent with how the word is typically used when describing events in media warnings. (i.e., This movie contains violence, this video game contains violence, etc. etc.) In the case of video games, they rarely refer to violence solely in the manner that you use it, with some notable exceptions like the Grand Theft Auto series (which I have never played) and a few others.

As a player, do you initiate the use of force in these games?

No, not in any game that I can think of. It could be argued that in World of Warcraft one might, except that in my understanding the Horde and the Alliance are in a constant state of warfare so attacking a Horde player before he attacks you is a matter of self-defense. Most of the time you won't know whether or not that particular player ever had any intention of attacking you or not. I'd really have to put more thought into some of the quests (moreso on the Horde side) than I care to to see if any of them involve initiating force. I play almost exclusively play the Alliance.

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Then why do it in a game? I don't understand that. Is it to satisfy some "violent urge" like what another poster said? How is it enjoyment for you? I'm just trying to broaden my understanding on your side of it, the gamer side of it.

Specifically murder, not kill. More often than not killing in a game is often a justified action. Murdering occurs far less often in games.

When I do it in a game it's usually to see what would happen, to see what interesting reaction I can get from the game, to see what was designed. Will I be punished? Do I get a reward? How does it affect the story? Sometimes games design interesting reactions to murdering a character in a game. Sometimes I'll murder a character for a far simpler reason, like I want his/her weapon and I don't care about the story.

These can be fun and interesting aspects of a fictional game completely seperate from reality.

Whether my actions in these games were ethical or not does not make it unethical in reality. I am not supporting murder or anything unethical in reality by doing so and I think any rational person can or should recognize that.

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Also let me pose a question for those who said yes, how does interactivity make violent content any more unethical?

I see no rational reason why anyone could make this claim.

Am I an unethical person if I go and watch a thrasher horror movie? No. I am not mentally ill or sick because I like some horror movies and to make that claim is absurd. Likewise with violent video games.

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Also let me pose a question for those who said yes, how does interactivity make violent content any more unethical?

What makes it unethical to me, Dorian, is the way in which the use of force was initiated in it. I wouldn't kill a person in a game just to get their weapon, unless they were about to use it, or are using it against me.

Edited by intellectualammo
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Whether my actions in these games were ethical or not does not make it unethical in reality. I am not supporting murder or anything unethical in reality by doing so and I think any rational person can or should recognize that.

I concur with this with one exception.

You may not play MMORPGs, but in World of Warcraft sometimes people "camp" other players with (what appears to be) the intent to aggravate them or interupt their game play. In the instances to which I refer, players of higher level, sometimes much higher level, will kill a lower level player (who stands no chance of winning) and then stays there to rekill him every time he comes back to life. This can happen sometimes for a half hour or more. This garners no gain in terms of the game whatsoever for the higher level player. Simple meaness in my book, directed at other people instead of just bits and bytes.

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Whether my actions in these games were ethical or not does not make it unethical in reality. I am not supporting murder or anything unethical in reality by doing so and I think any rational person can or should recognize that.

Well, you can support (morally sanction) the game in real life, which might be completely unethical, depending upon the nature of the game, too.

Edited by intellectualammo
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What makes it unethical to me, Dorian, is the way in which the use of force was initiated in it.

Okay, but to understand what you mean by unethical, how is he hurting himself or anyone else by doing this? For it to be unethical in real life, I think at the very least he actually has to be hurting himself in real life some way, or hurting someone else in real life some way.

I can accept that for you it would be unethical in the context of your life because you don't enjoy those games and you have no interest in playing them. For you to spend your time doing something you don't enjoy and have no interest would be "hurting" you. How is violence in video games "hurting" me or Dorian?

I think Dorian and I simply look at games as computer programs and we sometimes like to see what happens when we do certain things. Some times you learn interesting things about the game's mechanics when you do stuff like that. But those people in the game aren't really people, they have no real life and they are not really suffering or being harmed. It's a program and they are just bytes of information.

Well, you can support (morally sanction) the game in real life, which might be completely unethical, depending upon the nature of the game, too.

Well that depends. If I support the firearms industry by buying a gun, am I supporting all the loonies out there who will use a gun to violate other peoples rights or to commit suicide? I'm not using the gun in any immoral way.

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Okay, but to understand what you mean by unethical, how is he hurting himself or anyone else by doing this? For it to be unethical in real life, I think at the very least he actually has to be hurting himself in real life some way, or hurting someone else in real life some way.

His actions in the game can be judged. Even if in the game he can kill someone to get their weapon, doesn't make it right, in the game or in real life, even and especially if the game allows that to happen with no consequences/punishments, or if the rules allow him to do that, imo.

Well that depends. If I support the firearms industry by buying a gun, am I supporting all the loonies out there who will use a gun to violate other peoples rights or to commit suicide? I'm not using the gun in any immoral way.

That's not the same thing that I mean though. If the object of the game is what would be considered unethical immoral evil if acted upon in our real world, what's the point of playing it? I just don't see it. Buying such a game knowing it's object and contents is sanctioning the game, recommending such a game is further support/sanctioning of it. Why would a person want to play the bad guy? Why would a person want to play a game where the object is for a player to loot/pillage? Are playing those parts/commiting such actions in games unethical? I still say, yes. Is purchasing a games whose object is said object unethical? Yes. These are my opinions/judgments.

Edited by intellectualammo
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