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Prosletyzing versus good food

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MichaelH
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I was a big fan of a local sushi restaurant. The quality of their sushi is excellent. They are less expensive than the competition and are (in my opinion) better.

However, they recently printed new menus with a bible verse reference in the background of every page. It is large type and hard to miss. I was embarrassed to go there with my husband and a friend (all of us are athiests) and have the menu pushing us to pick up a bible when we just wanted food. We left without ordering anything.

I don't recall the chapter and verse referenced, but we did eventually look it up on-line and it has to do with honesty in business dealings.

I'd appreciate an Objectivist check of my analysis of the situation. I don't have a problem with the business owners being Christian or not. It's irrelevant to my purchase. The religious reference on the menu is the issue. That means:

1. Bringing friends into the restaurant implies I want them to read a bible. (I don't.) So, no eating in.

2. Ordering take-out from the restaurant would be fine because their take-out menu doesn't have the references. None of my friends will be exposed to the new menu, which means what's printed on it is a non-issue.

Although #2 feels like I'm hiding something, my other option is spending significantly more for worse-quality sushi. I feel like I'm doing the wrong thing no matter what I do. Do forum members have any thoughts on this?

Edited by MichaelH
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Your objection doesn't make any sense at all. You're going there to eat and enjoy food. Do the waiters serve you with an admonishment to say grace? Do you hear piped in hymns and choral chants through speakers in the walls?

No?

Then, ignore the bible reference on the menu and enjoy the pleasures of fine cuisine. You have to learn to be less uptight about your atheism. 99% of the world believes in some kind of god or religion, so I doubt this is the first or will be the last time you encounter religious references in your day to day life.

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You went into a privately owned business to buy food. That business owner has the right to print that on his menus. If that makes you not want to buy his food, that's your choice, but personally, I find it silly. If they were forcing you to say a prayer with them or something, then I wouldn't go.

On a related note, my friend went to meet with a client (a church) to give them a carpet quote. She arrived for the appointment on time and was told she'd have to wait 30 minutes until church service was over. My friend politely said that'd be fine and proceeded to walk back to the lobby area to wait. The woman stopped her and said, "You don't want to sit through the rest of the service?" My friend politely said no thanks and she didn't mind waiting up front, she had a book to read. Then the woman told her, "Well, we won't be needing your carpet quote."

Again, I have no problem with a religious company wanting to do business with another religious company; however, they should've been up front about it when they called to schedule the appointment. They should not have been so rude as to waste a business person's time and they shouldn't be trying to force their religion on someone else.

Edited by K-Mac
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I was embarrassed to go there with my husband and a friend (all of us are athiests) and have the menu pushing us to pick up a bible when we just wanted food. We left without ordering anything.

I don't recall the chapter and verse referenced, but we did eventually look it up on-line and it has to do with honesty in business dealings.

Does a bible reference to honesty in business really push you into picking up a bible? I'd say you're over-reacting. Man, I'd hate to see you in a Kosher deli!

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Does a bible reference to honesty in business really push you into picking up a bible? I'd say you're over-reacting. Man, I'd hate to see you in a Kosher deli!

If I put "Atlas Shrugged: Page 35, Paragraph 2" in the background on a menu, would you say I'm not encouraging people to read Atlas Shrugged nor pushing them towards Objectivism?

I guess I find it offensive more because it doesn't (IMO) belong in a business transaction. It sounds like the general consensus is: you're dealing with people, and since most people are religious, just expect it.

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They recently printed new menus with a bible verse reference in the background of every page.

How much fun would it be to have a menu with Galt's Speech passages printed on it? :lol:

I'm not sure why you would be embarrassed to go their.

There's nothing like a bad piece of dogmatic, irrational biblical scripture to start a conversation or to get a good chuckle about.

The some passages from the bible are great conceptual contrast for a rational epistemology.

Regards,

Michael

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Well, if they've got good food, I'd continue going there.

It's nothing compared to the "Vegetarian House" in San Jose! Check this out: *LINK*

You get to watch videos of the Supreme Master Ching Hai while enjoying their food. It's pretty bizarre. But I've been back, and brought people there. The food is good, and it's actually kind of an entertaining experience!

Learn more about the Supreme Master at her website, GodsDirectContact.com (I kid you not!) Apparently she's a very successful entrepreneurial philanthropist, very good at hobnobbing with folks with money.

So, you see, a few bible verses on the menu is pretty tame stuff. :lol:

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Objectivist restaurant. That's not at all a bad idea! Offended fundamentalists and socialists would actually advertise it for free, you could meat fellow objectivists there and the atmosphere should be created by photowallpapers of things like railroads, factories and New Your skyline. Also, artwork to be considered Romantic Realism. I would go there...

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You could put a sushi menu on a giant poster of Ayn Rand and Thomas Jefferson holding hands; I'd still walk across the street to get a steak.
If the choice were between a crappy steakhouse with a giant poster of Ayn Rand and Thomas Jefferson holding hands, and an excellent sushi restaurant redolent of Biblical quotes, what would your choice be?
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If the choice were between a crappy steakhouse with a giant poster of Ayn Rand and Thomas Jefferson holding hands, and an excellent sushi restaurant redolent of Biblical quotes, what would your choice be?
It would depend on my mood for food and how good I expected each to be.

MichaelH, the Bible quotes are irrelevant, in my opinion. If they get in the way somehow of you enjoying yourself, I'd first suggest that you just ignore them, but if you can't, just don't go. If you're worried about your friends, tell them about everything before showing up. But I think you're values sound slightly askew, and you're giving up great, cheap sushi for no good reason.

It sounds to me like the business is more concerned with honesty than the Bible, and they are probably just trying to connect with the American consumer. The Japanese vs. the Americans culturally are sometimes so clueless about one another. I once saw a (very nice) Japanese-run deli in NYC that was named "Space Market." There was nothing inside about outer space at all, they were just trying to suggest in the name that the environment was pleasant and felt spacious, which, uncommon in New York, it did. But they were obviously clueless about how to communicate that. Maybe the sushi place is doing the same thing.

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If the choice were between a crappy steakhouse with a giant poster of Ayn Rand and Thomas Jefferson holding hands, and an excellent sushi restaurant redolent of Biblical quotes, what would your choice be?

In that case, I'd go to KFC. Sushi is nasty. :lol:

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On a related note, my friend went to meet with a client (a church) to give them a carpet quote. She arrived for the appointment on time and was told she'd have to wait 30 minutes until church service was over. My friend politely said that'd be fine and proceeded to walk back to the lobby area to wait. The woman stopped her and said, "You don't want to sit through the rest of the service?" My friend politely said no thanks and she didn't mind waiting up front, she had a book to read. Then the woman told her, "Well, we won't be needing your carpet quote."

Now that's ridiculous, and frankly, what bugs me about a lot of the religious folks I've run into. Not all of them...but there have been times when folks do find out I am an atheist, and their attitude towards me changes totally. They complete "forget" all of the good qualities they liked about me (if it was a situation where we had known each other for a while).

I was a big fan of a local sushi restaurant. The quality of their sushi is excellent. They are less expensive than the competition and are (in my opinion) better.

However, they recently printed new menus with a bible verse reference in the background of every page. It is large type and hard to miss. I was embarrassed to go there with my husband and a friend (all of us are athiests) and have the menu pushing us to pick up a bible when we just wanted food. We left without ordering anything.

I don't recall the chapter and verse referenced, but we did eventually look it up on-line and it has to do with honesty in business dealings.

I'd appreciate an Objectivist check of my analysis of the situation. I don't have a problem with the business owners being Christian or not. It's irrelevant to my purchase. The religious reference on the menu is the issue. That means:

1. Bringing friends into the restaurant implies I want them to read a bible. (I don't.) So, no eating in.

2. Ordering take-out from the restaurant would be fine because their take-out menu doesn't have the references. None of my friends will be exposed to the new menu, which means what's printed on it is a non-issue.

Although #2 feels like I'm hiding something, my other option is spending significantly more for worse-quality sushi. I feel like I'm doing the wrong thing no matter what I do. Do forum members have any thoughts on this?

You could put on a T-shirt that says "A = A" or "Who is John Galt?" of something when you go to the restaurant. :lol:

Doesn't seem like something to get stressed out about. I'm sure your friends don't think you're all the sudden religious, do they?

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Now that's ridiculous, and frankly, what bugs me about a lot of the religious folks I've run into. Not all of them...but there have been times when folks do find out I am an atheist, and their attitude towards me changes totally. They complete "forget" all of the good qualities they liked about me (if it was a situation where we had known each other for a while).

Faith is fragile, and therefore feverishly aggressive.

As for the sushi: enjoy the restaurant's good offers and ignore the Bible quotes.

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