cliveandrews Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 (edited) I made a thread a year ago in which I discussed a serious, debilitating health problem which limits my choice of action and my ability to work: http://forum.ObjectivismOnline.com/index.p...c=16398&hl= I have a choice to make: I can either pursue a career as a medical billing/coding specialist, which will allow me to be financially independent, but which holds utterly no value whatsoever to me, or I can accept financial support from my parents, whom I despise, to attend college for 2-3 years to pursue a career that I would value highly and which would give my life meaning and purpose. I don't even know that the goal is realistic under the circumstances, but I will enjoy the journey and and am willing to gracefully accept my end if I try and it doesn't work out. I am currently in my first term at university and I love studying, but am overwhelmed by feelings of contempt and disgust for my rotten family. Their behavior disturbs me so much that it sometimes becomes psychologically debilitating. I physically live with them, but stay on campus for 12-16 hours a day to limit my exposure to them. Accepting their support requires me to conceal the extent of my disregard for my family and withold the kind of treatment which I would actually prefer to give them. The full context of the situation is difficult to communicate but my question boils down to this: is it wrong to accept support from a corrupt family, and is having a debilitating illness which limits my alternatives an important consideration? Edited May 15, 2010 by cliveandrews Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JASKN Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 You can probably assume that your parents have positive feelings toward you, even if you don't toward them. Imagine a scenario where you flat-out told them what you thought; they would probably be hurt, but they would get over it because of how they feel toward you. Furthermore, it comes with the territory of parenting that a child may grow up to have negative views toward his parents. And, you wouldn't go around to anyone else you didn't like telling them face to face, over and over again how much you don't like them. So, if your parents are offering to send you to college, it is their choice and I would take it and just hope for the best. You may grow to soften your views toward them with time, and the "depravity" won't seem so urgent to condemn and act out against. Sorry to hear about your disease; I doubt there's anyone who can tell you something to make you feel better, but I did like Myself's comment from the other thread about forgetting what could or should have been. Something to shoot for in your thinking, anyway. Something to note is that a well-paying job that gets you enough resources (money) to do something great besides the job (fun and hobbies), is a job worth having, at least for the short-term. If you only have the short-term, it could be a good option for you. However, if you're looking at a good ten years of life or so, that is plenty of time to move toward a long-term goal, and I would definitely go for the schooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake_Ellison Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 Is it wrong to accept support from relatives I despise? Yes. If you plan on accepting their help, you should first rethink your opinion of them. You either despise them, or value them and their help. You can't have it both ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JASKN Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 You either despise them, or value them and their help. You can't have it both ways.It would actually be, you either despise them and despise their help, despise them but value their help, value them but do not value their help, or value them and value their help. Or any level of those type of emotions combined with each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claire Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 (edited) As far as I can see, your family has supported you, is giving you food, shelter, an education, and I assume, a few other things. So, despite this, you DESPISE them. Do they have different beliefs than you do? They are entirely entitled to their differening opinions. They are also entitled to respect from someone they are providing for. My suggestion is you grow up before you start hating others. By the way, have you considered any connection between your health and your mental attitude? Edited May 15, 2010 by claire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake_Ellison Posted May 15, 2010 Report Share Posted May 15, 2010 (edited) It would actually be, you either despise them and despise their help, despise them but value their help, value them but do not value their help, or value them and value their help. Or any level of those type of emotions combined with each other. The source of one's emotions are either his rationally chosen values, or values he randomly and subconsciously embraces. A rational person evaluates people based on their value to himself: if someone is not only able and willing to help you, but you actually need and value their help, your feelings should reflect that essential characteristic which defines your relationship. If it doesn't, then you're living with a contradiction: you should solve it by either trying to change your feelings, or have your actions reflect your feelings, by distancing yourself from the object of your despise. I don't know the man and his parents, so I can't say which. He very well may be entirely right in despising them, in which case he needs to take the job and leave them right away. Depending on someone you despise is wrong. Edited May 15, 2010 by Jake_Ellison Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JASKN Posted May 16, 2010 Report Share Posted May 16, 2010 A "rational person" can evaluate someone based on other criterion than his value to one's self. Also, it is perfectly conceivable that one could despise one's dependant; that is why this thread was created, and you might be familiar with teenagers... A solution here can just be to stay cool and wait a while, a perfectly good approach when one is unsure of action and the elements suggesting action, when it is not an emergency. It is not always clear why one feels a certain way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliveandrews Posted May 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 (edited) As far as I can see, your family has supported you, is giving you food, shelter, an education, and I assume, a few other things. So, despite this, you DESPISE them. Do they have different beliefs than you do? They are entirely entitled to their differening opinions. They are also entitled to respect from someone they are providing for. My suggestion is you grow up before you start hating others. By the way, have you considered any connection between your health and your mental attitude? Edited May 22, 2010 by cliveandrews Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claire Posted May 22, 2010 Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 I'm sorry if the truth hurts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliveandrews Posted May 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 (edited) I'm sorry if the truth hurts. I'm not going to post my family details here because they are grotesque and don't belong on a forum which represents a philosophy dedicated to human happiness. All I'm going to say is that you have utterly no idea what the hell you're talking about. Are you even an Objectivist? Edited May 22, 2010 by cliveandrews Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claire Posted May 22, 2010 Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 Why do you ask? Because I believe people should be independent? Yes, that would be part of the objectivist creed.. Also, does it confuse you when I believe a 26-year old who lives at home and whines about his parents needs help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JASKN Posted May 22, 2010 Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 Why do you ask? Because I believe people should be independent? Yes, that would be part of the objectivist creed.. Also, does it confuse you when I believe a 26-year old who lives at home and whines about his parents needs help?You're taking the tone of an old friend who is at the end of her patience with a hard-headed friend. You would have to be very familiar with both the friend and his situation for that tone to be justified. How do you arrive there with only one fact of a 26-year-old complaining about his living situation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliveandrews Posted May 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 (edited) Why do you ask? Because I believe people should be independent? Yes, that would be part of the objectivist creed.. Also, does it confuse you when I believe a 26-year old who lives at home and whines about his parents needs help? Did you read the part where I said I have a seriously debilitating, possibly life-threatening physical illness which severely limits my choice of action and has made it almost impossible to find suitable work? And did it not occur to you that living with my parents is not my preferred arrangement, but one that has been forced on me by circumstances beyond my control? Or are you satisfied with rotten distortions like the implication that I'm just too stupid and lazy to move out of my mom's basement? Edited May 22, 2010 by cliveandrews Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyco Posted May 23, 2010 Report Share Posted May 23, 2010 A suggestion: accept support from your family but only on the condition that they expect you to repay them at some future point. Maybe even with a formal contract. They might not understand your motives but from your perspective you can then accept their support with a clear conscience. To accept it otherwise is essentially pretending that you don't despise them, making you a pawn to their mistaken impression. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
claire Posted May 23, 2010 Report Share Posted May 23, 2010 Yes, I read about your arthritis. Did You read when I asked you if you thought there is any connection with your thinking and your health. Arthritis is a physical condition frequently caused by our mental condition. I wasn't being mean when I asked that question. Arthritis is one of those conditions where "change your thinking, change your body," all too often applies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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