Depressed Friend/s

[emanon]

Hi All,

I've had a friend for about two years who has been depressed for probably 75% of that time. She's seen/sees a psych and takes anti-depressants but still it persists.

I have personally been depressed twice in my short life for 3 or 4 months a turn, and as a result I learned a lot about what causes me to go down that dreary emotional road, how to avoid it, and what I need to do to get back again.

The two things that seem to be very different about us however, is that I never considered suicide an option... or rather, I considered it briefly and ruled it out. Secondly, is that no matter how "low" I got, I always wanted to be happy and be able to enjoy life. She doesn't seem to experience this.

The problem is that I can see what so many of the causes for her depression are and what would help her, but for me, it is such a test of patience when dealing with someone who obstinately refuses to take action to help herself.

To be clear, I'm not that person who tells her to do things then makes a big deal when she doesn't. I do make suggestions, but I try and remain impassive as to whether she actually takes them... (Which is never, to my knowledge)

I find it personally incredibly challenging to deal with a person who refuses to act in their own interest, and who has adopted this view point that the world should be some magical place where everything gets done for you and you just magically get everything you want, without any effort or responsibility... and then gets upset because it fails to live up to this expectation.

The fact is, that as far as I can tell, she really doesn't want to get better. I don't know whether it is because she gets more attention this way? Or whether it gives her a perpetual excuse for not taking action to become an independent.

Either way, I just don't know how to proceed. I don't know if I can be friends with her much longer unless she takes affirmative action because our views of the world are so drastically different that we are no longer able to relate in anything but a superficial way.

Does anyone have any suggestions or anecdotal advice? lol

Chris

[bluecherry]

What kinds of suggestions have you been making? Could you elaborate more on her bad views? Has she tried changing her meds and/or shrink if the current ones just aren't cutting the mustard?

[Drregaleagle]

Objectivist philosophy can be a great aid to depression. Unlike every other world view that is obsessed with an individual's status being determined by either society or a divine being, Objectivism emphasizes an individual trying to achieve his own goals without caring about what other people want. I think the best long term treatment for depression is the constructive achievement that comes from one trying to accomplish something. In some ways, the pursuit of one's goals should make him happy even if he doesn't always succeed because he keeps trying and remains determined.

It can't be smart to give up a friend. The best way to strengthen a friendship happens to be the best way to fix depression, work on common problems for common ends.

Edited November 21, 2010 by Drregaleagle

[bluecherry]

"I think the best long term treatment for depression is the constructive achievement that comes from one trying to accomplish something. In some ways, the pursuit of one's goals should make him happy even if he doesn't always succeed because he keeps trying and remains determined."

This sounds nice and all, but depending on what it is that is upsetting somebody (which is still not very clear from the OP), that may be useless and/or not very feasible. If you are upset about something not closely related to your work and you are feeling seriously worried about how this issue may perhaps strongly negatively impact what kind of quality of life is possible to you in the future, you may have your motivation to work very seriously undermined. It's very hard to work well on something substantial without the motivation to do it. Furthermore, it may give you little to no satisfaction to accomplish things at work if you are feeling like it is all futile because something else in your life seems to mean no matter what you do that you still won't be able to get that kind of life you really, really want and maybe even need. Also, if she actually has a physical problem, the good philosophy alone can't solve everything, getting the right medication would still be needed in conjunction with the good philosophy. In general, you probably need to first find out the root of the problem before you can figure out if you can push somebody to get back to working or if that will have to stay on hold for a while longer until other things are addressed.

(Woo, my 400th post! )

[SapereAude]

Hi All,

I've had a friend for about two years who has been depressed for probably 75% of that time. She's seen/sees a psych and takes anti-depressants but still it persists.

I have personally been depressed twice in my short life for 3 or 4 months a turn, and as a result I learned a lot about what causes me to go down that dreary emotional road, how to avoid it, and what I need to do to get back again.

The two things that seem to be very different about us however, is that I never considered suicide an option... or rather, I considered it briefly and ruled it out. Secondly, is that no matter how "low" I got, I always wanted to be happy and be able to enjoy life. She doesn't seem to experience this.

The problem is that I can see what so many of the causes for her depression are and what would help her, but for me, it is such a test of patience when dealing with someone who obstinately refuses to take action to help herself.

To be clear, I'm not that person who tells her to do things then makes a big deal when she doesn't. I do make suggestions, but I try and remain impassive as to whether she actually takes them... (Which is never, to my knowledge)

I find it personally incredibly challenging to deal with a person who refuses to act in their own interest, and who has adopted this view point that the world should be some magical place where everything gets done for you and you just magically get everything you want, without any effort or responsibility... and then gets upset because it fails to live up to this expectation.

The fact is, that as far as I can tell, she really doesn't want to get better. I don't know whether it is because she gets more attention this way? Or whether it gives her a perpetual excuse for not taking action to become an independent.

Either way, I just don't know how to proceed. I don't know if I can be friends with her much longer unless she takes affirmative action because our views of the world are so drastically different that we are no longer able to relate in anything but a superficial way.

Does anyone have any suggestions or anecdotal advice? lol

Chris

1) even if she is on meds they may not be the right ones, the right combination, or the right dosage. Medicating depression is largely trial and error unfortunately. Different medications interact in different ways. Plus, most have side effects some of which can cause new bouts of depression (many men get very upset about some of the sexual side effects, women tend to experience weight gain, etc)

2) even if her meds were correct and the right dose like all else your body and mind habituates. I have a close friend who will probably be spending their life on meds. every 3 years or so the meds they're on stop working. then the trial and error for a new combination starts again

3) you say your friend doesn't seem interested in doing the things that will get her out of her depression. Well, that is unfortunately part of being severely depressed. Lack of hope. Lack of interest in happiness or a belief that happiness is impossible.

4) could she be a drama queen out to get attention by staying depressed? Well, there are several "personality disorders" that could be mitigating factors outside of the actual clinical depression- BPD, NPD and so on... frustrating for those close to her but hard for her to control on her own.

5) many find some relief with cognitive behavioral therapy. A good CB therapist doesn't come cheap though. And the bad ones are useless.

If you friend is of value to you I suggest being patient and doing what you can. As much as it sucks being her friend imagine how awful not having control of her own thoughts and feelings is for her. Decide if she's worth the trouble because there will be trouble and if she's worth it.. be patient, be kind and try to understand. Also, set very firm boundaries. Enabling behaviors will only make her worse.