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Any decent jobs that don't require a degree?

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Retail, restaurant, cleaning services of all kinds, really all services for still in-demand industries, any special trade like painting or automotive repair, warehouse work, truck driver... and many more.

If you can get very skilled at anything, you can make a living at it. A living is relative, and your goals determine your standards. Entrepreneurship isn't for everybody but it is for *somebody.*

Don't fret about quitting school in the long term even if the temporary short term is tough. There are so many roads without school, many of which haven't even been traveled yet.

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I define "living" as paying for rent, every so often video games.. A few bigger luxury purchases a year like computer components or periphreals..

And maybe saving up enough in case something happens..

I've never been interested in Entrepeneurship I prefer working for other people. Then again if I was amazing at developing apps, I might be self employed doing that...

I digress.. I will take those into account, thanks.

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Being a soldier.

At least in the Canadian Forces it is a way to make quite a good living at a young age and when/if you should release you get a good serverance and perks such as education and/or training grants. I'm fairly certain that the US Army has similar programs but others can probably speak to these better than I.

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Finding a GOOD sales job can get you more than a decent salary. It's not easy though, and you really have to find a good employer.

Almost any job can open doors for you though. A friend of mine used to work as a grunt for DHL, and somehow that led him to product development for Sony. At my current job I started with virtually brainless tasks in the archives. Now i'm dealing with far more complex legal matters, and soon i'll hopefully be going to a law firm(as an assistant, not a lawyer... yet).

Any job that is nice enough to stand for a while, and that rewards you for being good, is a fine place to start. Just make sure you always go that extra mile.

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Any job that is nice enough to stand for a while, and that rewards you for being good, is a fine place to start. Just make sure you always go that extra mile.

Excellently put. Minor caveat: don't count on management to further your career unless they show an active interest in promoting you. As with all things, move your life along yourself. I say this because I have seen many a group of managers try to string higher-performing employees along under the pretense of "appreciation" or negligible rewards.
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Excellently put. Minor caveat: don't count on management to further your career unless they show an active interest in promoting you. As with all things, move your life along yourself. I say this because I have seen many a group of managers try to string higher-performing employees along under the pretense of "appreciation" or negligible rewards.

I've learned the hardware the managers try to string employee's along..

Hence why I'm trying to get some ideas before jumping into anything.

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I've learned the hardware the managers try to string employee's along..

I think you meant:

"I've learned the hard way that managers try to string employees along..."

If you wish to get a well paying job working for someone else that doesn't primarily require manual labor, then I'd encourage you to remain in school at least long enough to take some additional English Language courses.

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Blowing a huge amount of money on something like lit crit or "women's studies" is hardly useful, and supporting these organizations is something I sometimes have trouble doing (I attend a typically left wing university).

It is not always even needed. Work hard in a field and the Capitalist system will reward you appropriately. Don't listen to the Michael Moore's out there, or any on here. Hard work is rewarded.

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Snow_Fox: what were you studying? How far along did you get? Did you have a plan when you started?

Let's assume the answers are: general eds/liberal arts (a monkeytrap if there ever was one); somewhere in the second year of a four-year (again, hahahaha) degree; and no, not really, but medicine / pre-law / business sounded good.

Let's also assume that you may want to go back to that initial idea, but. not. right. now. JASKN's pretty much nailed that.

What you DO want to, in my omniscient opinion, is to identify what you're good at now, what your real passion is, and what it would take to get good at it. I'd set the "decent paying" goal out there, but the plain fact is you don't get paid much of anything, if at all, unless you've got some value to offer. Which would be...? By the way, a good attitude, showing up on time, and the other associated plays-well-with-others qualities are just the baseline requirements.

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JASKN: Good point. It's very important to take charge of things yourself, instead of just hoping someone takes notice and rewards you. It's rarely enough to just do a good job.

Jorge: Hard work is not rewarded. Good work can be, but only if it gets noticed and your employer recognizes it as a value. It's often up to you to make sure they do that.

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I think you meant:

"I've learned the hard way that managers try to string employees along..."

If you wish to get a well paying job working for someone else that doesn't primarily require manual labor, then I'd encourage you to remain in school at least long enough to take some additional English Language courses.

Not to be a jackass or someone who only makes excuses.

However, a million grammar and English courses are only going to be about as productive as pissing in the wind.

It will result in me writing up a paper in the worst grammar you've ever seen in your life, then having someone correct my mistakes one page one.. and me fixing the mistakes on page 2 through 6.

rinse and repeat until I have a passable English paper. I lack the ability to maintain great grammar. Along the way, wasting insane amounts of time I could be doing far more productive things, like learning code..

In fact, in order to make relevant post on most forums, I must totally forsake grammar in order to post before the thread is totally irrelevant. Believe me, I've taken more English courses than you'd probably realize.

Snow_Fox: what were you studying? How far along did you get? Did you have a plan when you started?

Let's assume the answers are: general eds/liberal arts (a monkeytrap if there ever was one); somewhere in the second year of a four-year (again, hahahaha) degree; and no, not really, but medicine / pre-law / business sounded good.

Let's also assume that you may want to go back to that initial idea, but. not. right. now. JASKN's pretty much nailed that.

What you DO want to, in my omniscient opinion, is to identify what you're good at now, what your real passion is, and what it would take to get good at it. I'd set the "decent paying" goal out there, but the plain fact is you don't get paid much of anything, if at all, unless you've got some value to offer. Which would be...? By the way, a good attitude, showing up on time, and the other associated plays-well-with-others qualities are just the baseline requirements.

I am a Comp Sci major and I would love to be a programmer. I am in Data Structures this semester and have decided to at least finish this semester..

I am having more trouble with my Comp Sci classes this year than I have had since I started..however, I'm hoping to at least finish and have a great understanding of data structures. I want to stay in CMPS if anything..

Edited by Snow_Fox
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I lack the ability to maintain great grammar. Along the way, wasting insane amounts of time I could be doing far more productive things, like learning code..

Grammar is an essential thing to understand. The same with arithmetic. To put it bluntly, it is silly to think that you can get by in life without being able to write at least decently. Coding may be an essential skill for you to have, but what will you do if you need to write a resume? A business proposal for a loan? A document explaining to others a goal of yours that requires a team effort? Writing ability is a necessary skill to have these days.

No one inherently lacks the ability to maintain great grammar. You might need lots of practice, maybe you need to change how you approach learning instead. I should add: What is grammar except coding language for human understanding? If you can do code, you can do grammar.

Edited by Eiuol
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Not to be a jackass or someone who only makes excuses.

However, a million grammar and English courses are only going to be about as productive as pissing in the wind.

Yep, you're making excuses.

I lack the ability to maintain great grammar.

Cultivate it.

In fact, in order to make relevant post on most forums, I must totally forsake grammar in order to post before the thread is totally irrelevant. Believe me, I've taken more English courses than you'd probably realize.

I am a Comp Sci major and I would love to be a programmer. I am in Data Structures this semester and have decided to at least finish this semester..

Listen, I'm an older you, with one exception. See, I don't have a degree either, but I have a successful career which includes a 15 year history as a Consultant where my advice was given to major company IT departments like T. Rowe Price, Legg Mason, (then) Blue Cross/Blue Shield (now Carefirst), Aon, and quite a few more. I've sat on a hell of a lot of interviews in my consulting career as a candidate, and on even more interviews on the Interviewer side as a reviewer of potential candidates.

I've also been posting on computer message boards since before the internet was known to more than the military and a few cutting edge Computer Science departments.

I assure you - if you assume a "piss on Grammar" mindset, you will do more to hamper your own potential future than the lack of degree ever would.

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Speaking of grammar, I thought that I would mention here that Dr. Peikoff's lecture, Principles of Grammar, is now on sale (due to the Ayn Rand Bookstore's recent announcement that they are selling their in-stock, self-published audio and video products at half price while they last, and that they will soon be offering their audio and video products via downloads) for $120 (plus shipping).

While supplies last.

As well, I've recently been informed that Dr. Peikoff's lecture on grammar is currently being edited by Dr. Michael Berliner to appear in a book about a year from now, around September 2012 or so. More information can be obtained from Dr. Berliner at the Ayn Rand Institute.

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  • 3 months later...

As someone who works in the trucking industry I can tell you that truck drivers are very much in demand. We have a 100,000 employee shortfall which is projected to get worse between regulations, medical standards, and the retirement of the old guard. You can easily make more than a person graduating with a B.A. in this economy and companies will line up to hire you. Recruiting is in overdrive since so many companies need drivers.

More importantly though, is that if you wish to finish your degree you could do it online. There is down time and most truck stops or terminals have wireless internet hookup so you could do this from the road too - Save money and finish your education. It might not be ideal (it's a lifestyle) but it could help you out for several years and get you some savings.

Just do your homework and make sure you get a good company. Finding out you don't like your employer when you are 1,000 miles from home is no way to start a new job.

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As someone who works in the trucking industry I can tell you that truck drivers are very much in demand.
I heard a story about this on the radio. They were talking about one company (I think it was J.B.Hunt) that had set up or financed a training school for drivers, to get more qualified people into the field.

The other place where there's a job boom these days is the oil patch in North Dakota, though I assume that these jobs would require some type of experience or technical training.

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Most jobs I've looked into require at least a bachelor's in computer science, but that's the very minimum. You also need to have work experience and internships to put on your resume that relate to the job you're applying for. I know there's a lot of self-taught programmers who say that a college degree is a waste of time, but they've been programming for years (just for FUN), and they're really self-disciplined. Judging from your posts, it doesn't sound like you have either of these traits. I feel like higher level CS courses are meant to weed out people who just 'don't get it.' If you aren't doing good in these (but are still interested in CS), you might want to change your study habits or even retake some lower level classes so that you can build a stronger foundation and see what you missed the first time around.

I've found myself going back to this article all the time and following the links to see what things I need to know by the time I graduate. Just going through classes and passing with C's won't get you anywhere. This other good article explains the difference between coders with degrees and without. There's a lot of good arguments for getting a degree: you 1) learn how to code, 2) learn how to learn new languages, 3) learn a variety of languages, 4) learn how to write, 5) learn how to document, 6) learn important concepts, 7) get a good mathematical foundation, 8) learn about what you're good at and what you need to work on, and 9) learn what fields you are and are not interested in. A lot of this can come from classes, reading and practicing, and work experience. On top of all these computer-related skills, you'll also learn everyday skills: how to live on your own, budget money, work in teams, etc.

But what are the arguments for not finishing your degree? There really aren't any. You might have more free time to waste, or you might get a job in the field you want (but won't that be really unlikely?) - on top of that, you won't be able to quit if, for some reason, you don't like your job (if you don't have another one). How will you support yourself? How will you make it to a bunch of day-time job interviews?

Anyways, it's a bad idea to just drop out because you had a bad semester.

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"Grammar is an essential thing to understand. The same with arithmetic. To put it bluntly, it is silly to think that you can get by in life without being able to write at least decently. Coding may be an essential skill for you to have, but what will you do if you need to write a resume? A business proposal for a loan? A document explaining to others a goal of yours that requires a team effort? Writing ability is a necessary skill to have these days.

No one inherently lacks the ability to maintain great grammar. You might need lots of practice, maybe you need to change how you approach learning instead. I should add: What is grammar except coding language for human understanding? If you can do code, you can do grammar."

Hah -- very well put.

Snow Fox, if you're interested in the computer sciences, then I am guessing that you will have a lot of competion. In which case, you will need to stand out for your abilities, reliability, and attention to detail. Poor writing skills might just tell a potential employer that you lack the first and third of those qualities.

Eiuol is right.

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A degree opens doors, and is even esential for some careers. Having said that, for many many careers a degree is simply not important.

I ran out of money and had to quit college, bounced around for a few years, started a business - made a lot of money, lost a lot of money, shut that business down and went broke, started anoother business, and am making a damn good living now with a small chain of retail stores.

It sounds trute, but find something that you truly enjoy doing and work your ass off at it. If you love what you are doing, you are far more likely to make a lot of money.

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