Jason Fowler Posted April 17, 2005 Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 I already nominated her quite some time ago and I think I put Ayn Rand at the top, but now that I think about it Jefferson and Washington should be above her. These men directly laid the foundation for the greatest nation that ever existed.. the most free, individualistic, selfish, proud, and productive. I'd say that puts them at the top as far as greatest Americans are concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manavmehta Posted April 17, 2005 Report Share Posted April 17, 2005 I already nominated her quite some time ago and I think I put Ayn Rand at the top, but now that I think about it Jefferson and Washington should be above her. These men directly laid the foundation for the greatest nation that ever existed.. the most free, individualistic, selfish, proud, and productive. I'd say that puts them at the top as far as greatest Americans are concerned. I guess you and I are using different criteria to measure greatness. To me, being great as an American is a measure of to what degree you embody the central principles on which this nation was built. In that sense, Ayn Rand definitely trumps the founding fathers. They demonstrated many virtues which she did, but they did not demonstrate as unswerving a commitment to rationality as Ayn Rand did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Fowler Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 I guess you and I are using different criteria to measure greatness. To me, being great as an American is a measure of to what degree you embody the central principles on which this nation was built. In that sense, Ayn Rand definitely trumps the founding fathers. They demonstrated many virtues which she did, but they did not demonstrate as unswerving a commitment to rationality as Ayn Rand did. If it weren't for men like Washington and Jefferson, there might not have been such a thing as "American". Even if there were, the meaning of it and what it embodied would be diminished. Their deism hardly diminishes this and, in fact, I think it is very far from representing a significant flaw. As a side-note to this: If this was the greatest American of the 20th century then I'd definately say Ayn Rand, it would be difficult for me to even find a comparison to make. It seems now the nominations have been made and in less than 1 day they will be revealed. Then there will be a vote on these nominees for greatest American. There will be information presented on each nominee and, assuming Ayn Rand makes it, it will be interesting to see what "features" they have of her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manavmehta Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 If it weren't for men like Washington and Jefferson, there might not have been such a thing as "American". Even if there were, the meaning of it and what it embodied would be diminished. Their deism hardly diminishes this and, in fact, I think it is very far from representing a significant flaw. Washington and Jefferson's achievement was indeed great and momentous, and if it wasn't for Ayn Rand, there would be no other close contenders to them for this title, but I still don't follow your reasoning. Your argument seems to me to be similar to saying that Adam was the greatest human being just because he was the first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wrath Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 When and where does this come on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wrath Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 Ayn Rand, herself, considered Aristotle the greatest man/philosopher to ever live. She considered him greater than herself, yet she believed he had flaws. The reason she considered him greater is because he laid the foundation for Western philosophy, just like I consider Washington and Jefferson greater because they laid a certain foundation. Adam, if he existed, didn't really lay a foundation for anything. Washington and Jefferson's achievement was indeed great and momentous, and if it wasn't for Ayn Rand, there would be no other close contenders to them for this title, but I still don't follow your reasoning. Your argument seems to me to be similar to saying that Adam was the greatest human being just because he was the first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wrath Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 So, who made the list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wrath Posted April 24, 2005 Report Share Posted April 24, 2005 Good lord...the list is a joke. It's got Michael Moore, Hugh Hefner, Daddy Bush, Baby Bush, Mama Bush, Wifey Bush, Hill and Bill, Pat Tillman, Bret Favre...just read it yourself. Really quite pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realitycheck44 Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 (edited) Where can I read the list? [edit: Okay never mind. I'm retarded.] Edited April 25, 2005 by realitycheck44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidV Posted April 25, 2005 Report Share Posted April 25, 2005 I have my own list of favorite people here: http://photos.rationalmind.net/Heroes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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