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Shameful Display of Anarchy and Violence

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14 January 2021 We will crush their violence enacted under their feast of self-delusion and contempt for our Constitutional rule of law. The republic will prevail. The citizens on both sides are

As America prepares to certify our next President, a large band of hooligans have taken upon themselves to storm the Capitol.  This in the name of Freedom?  Are these hooligans striving to look for th

I have enough superstition about me not to want to declare that we've survived this, just yet. But despite everything, it looks better to me today than it did yesterday, and it's the first time in a w

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No need , gotcha.

You keep implying that every allegation was fraudulent in and of itself every one. Every case being not heard was a legitimate consequence and that every judge or body made legally consistent arguments against every case ,every one. 

As an example this particular suit and any relief that may have been granted  to the campaign was relatively inconsequential as far as the national results. Irrespective of Trump as candidate, an objective reading of the decision and the opinions of the dissenters was rather illuminating in electoral law cases , at least for this layman. 

Edited by tadmjones
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14 minutes ago, Eiuol said:

As long as you say that this is not a false flag operation by antifa, and that a large number of individuals (150+) were engaging in seditious activity while attempting an insurrection, that's all that really matters.

That would require ignoring actual evidence.

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35 minutes ago, tadmjones said:

Sure as long you say burning police cars and attacking federal buildings are acts of insurrection, and it’s  really only a misdemeanor now.

They are acts of sedition by definition. Maybe there is a double standard there. It does not mean this act of sedition is okay because the left gets away with it.

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7 minutes ago, tadmjones said:

Are you sure about that , I mean you did take the time to post that correction.

It's possible that the police cars have to be federal police for that to be considered sedition. Also, has to be two or more people which should include all the ones you are including.

Falls under: 

  • To oppose by force the authority of the United States government; to prevent, hinder, or delay by force the execution of any law of the United States; or
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50 minutes ago, necrovore said:

That would require ignoring actual evidence.

I went over each one of these points in a prior post just because at least you gave some kind of evidence no matter how small. And now we know that the reason that first cop was "leading people up the stairs" was because he was leading them away from the Senate chamber. You know, preventing the explicit goal of what an insurrection would be after. The only thing going for you is that there was the antifa guy outside the Capitol. Great, one possible agent provocateur who wasn't even caught doing something suspicious. Since that's all you have, it's fair to say you failed to make a case. 

Anyway, I'm more interested in talking now if anyone cares, just about the nature of what was going on, and what we might call insurrectionary or what we might just call a riot. 

https://twitter.com/jsrailton/status/1349506205526454278

https://twitter.com/i/status/1349372058237546496
 

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9 hours ago, necrovore said:

That would require ignoring actual evidence.

At least SOMEONE is asking the right questions. By all other reporting the narrative has been fixed and incontrovertible. Ie. The whole country's Trump support and the president himself was involved in this act of 'sedition'. The soft minds and feelings of the many ~know~ this is what happened and won't hear of any contradiction.

The latest, CNN breathlessly reports, is the attack was "planned". Well, sure. By a few or some, in all probability. What is so amazing about that? Would it have been better or worse that the invasion was completely spontaneous?

Proven: if a few hundred of Trump support are stupid, bad or rotten, all 70+ million must also be. That's their logic and view of people and humanity.

But The Leftists have used a method in the past years which is so childishly obvious. "Never let a good crisis go to waste". Work everything to our own advantage. Divide and rule. Foster racial divides and pandemic fears and sedition 'horrors' - Tear the fabric of society apart for ultimate control, no matter at whose sacrifice.

It is the Leftists' obviousness, arrogance, overreach, anti-values and hypocritical double standards - and ridiculousness - which I hope will bring their downfall. Most Americans are not blind or permanently subservient as these people assume.

Edited by whYNOT
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14 January 2021

We will crush their violence enacted under their feast of self-delusion and contempt for our Constitutional rule of law. The republic will prevail. The citizens on both sides are armed if it should come to that, but I expect the organized force of the American government will succeed in defense and in bringing the violators to commensurate penalty.

Tony: Indeed the American citizens overwhelmingly are not so stupid as to buy into Left-tarring of the bulk of Republicans as fascists and white-supremacist. And they are overwhelmingly not so stupid as to buy into the Right-tarring of the bulk of Democrats (and Biden/Harris) as socialists or communists.

Many of my relatives and friends voted for Donald Trump in 2020. Most of them have detested his behaviors with regard to the election result. What they had in common with Trump voters who bought and sold the BIG LIE of a purported Trump/Pence win of this national election being STOLEN was only a preference for that ticket over the Democratic one. It is not the case that those who showed up for the fateful Trump rally are representative of the majority of citizens who voted for Mr. Trump.

~American Republic Forever~

gettysburg_pennsylvania_cannon_tree_statue_sculpture_civil_war-600302.jpg

Edited by Boydstun
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4 hours ago, whYNOT said:

At least SOMEONE is asking the right questions. By all other reporting the narrative has been fixed and incontrovertible. Ie. The whole country's Trump support and the president himself was involved in this act of 'sedition'.

Did you click the link? Necro was using it as evidence that the whole thing was a false flag operation. He wasn't using it as counter evidence that this was not sedition. Even a false flag would be sedition if that's what we were talking about. But it isn't what we were talking about.

The particular narrative I've heard is that 1) Trump incited violence based on the context of all the other speakers before him, 2) the majority of people who went to the Capitol were attempting to break in and overturn or prevent Biden from being confirmed. That's the gist of what I get from NYT. I disagree with 2, because as I said many times, I think only a portion of people inside had seditious intent. 

The right questions would be things like: who inside, if anyone, was committing sedition? What is the difference between sedition and merely damage of federal property? How do we distinguish between someone walking around the chaos just watching, from someone conspiring to commit sedition? What are the minimum number of participants for a particular subgroup of people to qualify as an insurrection (as in, what portion of the riot, if any, was attempting insurrection)? 

5 hours ago, whYNOT said:

It is the Leftists' obviousness, arrogance, overreach, anti-values and hypocritical double standards - and ridiculousness - which I hope will bring their downfall. Most Americans are not blind or permanently subservient as these people assume.

Good thing none of us here are leftists. 

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On 1/13/2021 at 12:22 PM, Doug Morris said:

Please quote or link so I can see what you're talking about.

How many democrat politicians?  Does this refer to anything other than employment by the federal government?  Is there any definition or clarification of what they mean by "Trump ‘sycophants and fabulists ‘"?

How do you justify including this?

tadmjones, did you overlook this, or do you need more time, or do you just not have an answer?

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I don't believe anyone will be seriously threatened or endangered because they say that what happened at the Capitol was just a riot, not an insurrection and/or they say that Trump is not a nazi and/or they say that Trump is better than Biden and/or they wear a MAGA hat and/or they say that they aren't sure that the election was valid.

Saying flat out that the election was invalid might be a bit more problematic because it is associated with violence.  But if they can come up with some solid facts to back up the statement, that would help them.

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doug morris 

I did originally qualify my hyperbole “barely hyperbolic “ :)

And by public or very public I was insinuating online/social media presence. I doubt my butcher would banish me from his store if a conversation turned to the happenings at the Capitol and we explored the nuisances of the proper description/context. So perhaps my statements overshot a specific mark , but the volley is in the right direction, no?

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As in the case of other coup attempts, the president’s actions have put us on the brink of civil war. Trump did not overturn the election results, but, just as he intended, he disrupted the peaceful democratic transition of executive power.

Unless the Big Lie is thoroughly refuted, we can expect more attempts to subvert the constitutional order from Trump’s supporters—and we still have to get through the January 20 inauguration. The president’s actions and his falsehoods have shattered America’s democratic norms, exacerbated its political divisions and put people’s lives at risk. Five people died during events surrounding the storming of the Capitol, including a member of the U.S. Capitol Police force. Many of the members of Congress who backed Trump’s efforts were themselves at risk of injury or death.

If we are to restore democratic norms and make sure this does not happen again, these congressional Republicans will have to take personal responsibility for their actions in support of Trump’s coup attempt. They must tell the truth to their constituents about the election and what the president tried to do in January 2021. They owe it to the people they represent as well as the country they serve.

From the Link in my last post

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Every user of Parler?

The report that Curt Shilling had his homeowners insurance coverage cancelled because of social media posts.

Another report of a former staffer to Trump that was fired because NHL refused to do business with the company if they employed that specific employee for the reason of his Trump association.

Edited by tadmjones
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5 hours ago, Eiuol said:

Did you click the link? Necro was using it as evidence that the whole thing was a false flag operation. He wasn't using it as counter evidence that this was not sedition. Even a false flag would be sedition if that's what we were talking about. But it isn't what we were talking about.

 

Did you? He asked why they were allowed in? Etc. Same as I asked, why a woman and other cohorts was permitted to get to the door leading to the inner sanctum, when there were fully armed riot police in the vicinity. No restraint until then - And THEN to be gunned down trying to slip through. Is that rational, or is it immoral?

He (or I )doesn't have to be suggesting any conspiracy theory to ask those vital questions about access.

Edited by whYNOT
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10 minutes ago, Easy Truth said:

From the Link in my last post

This article doesn’t at all touch on the unique and extraordinary  character of a one of a kind , first time ever, unlike any other election, election.

There are non irrational arguments that point to irregularities and there hasn’t been any well publicized extraordinary efforts to demonstrate serious effort was expended on securing the elections.If fact there are a lot of questions of the actions on officials in charge of a number of polling places , especially concerning chain of custody of the extraordinary number of mail / paper ballots .

The narrative the article speaks to is only consistent if the media caricature of Trump is believed. It is just as irrational to believe in lizard shape shifters as to believe Trump is an insane megalomaniac.

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8 hours ago, Boydstun said:

Tony: Indeed the American citizens overwhelmingly are not so stupid as to buy into Left-tarring of the bulk of Republicans as fascists and white-supremacist. And they are overwhelmingly not so stupid as to buy into the Right-tarring of the bulk of Democrats (and Biden/Harris) as socialists or communists.

 

~American Republic Forever~

gettysburg_pennsylvania_cannon_tree_statue_sculpture_civil_war-600302.jpg

Stephen, in the first instance of tarring, I will take it to the bank that a full 95%+ of Republicans/Trump supporters are bitterly ashamed of and frustrated by the acts of the few of the few who entered the Capitol and acted foully; in the second tarring, I heard and saw not an iota of outcry from Democrat supporters in various media about the events of the past months e.g. - "We are going too far in our efforts to defeat Trump, at cost to America" -

Conversely, many including Harris reveled in the riots. ("Peaceful, justifiable, protests that should continue through the elections").

In other words, I think many to most Democrats deserve to be tarred with a power-hungry Left-Socialist brush.

Not at first, but slowly I expect you will see the Left turning more Left, particularly when Kamala Harris comes in. Even they know too much too soon will shock Americans.

Edited by whYNOT
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