Do You Have Children?

[softwareNerd]

From my previous poll asking about members ages, I assume that a vast majority of the members here are young enough not to have kids yet. Still, I'm curious how many parents we do have here. Thus this poll.

(There's a special category for Felipe's dogs: Ragnar and Alex !)

As for me: we have one son - 7 years old.

Edited July 26, 2005 by softwareNerd

[HaloNoble6]

Heh, all the same except for the simple fact that those heathens will never grow up.

[Groovenstein]

Felipe, please tell me Ragnar's a really tiny dog like a chihuahua or something. I've always thought it funny when small dogs have menacing names. If I ever have a tiny dog, I'm going to name him "Beast."

[HaloNoble6]

Sorry to spoil it for you, but he's a decent-sized (for his age) Boxer. Flashy fawn with a black mask. The name didn't work out, though, cause he's scared of the vacuum cleaner.

[Sparhawk]

Unless my neigbours cat counts no kids......

[studentofobjectivism]

I would like to know: what's the rational basis for having children? What if they grow up to be a person that you don't value?

[Proverb]

I would like to know: what's the rational basis for having children? What if they grow up to be a person that you don't value?

I would value the propagation of the human race enough to have children. If I had children it would be because I would have the ability to make them into virtuous individuals that shared at least some of my values. (Not until then) There are other reasons but that sums up the essentials.

[Groovenstein]

I would like to know: what's the rational basis for having children? What if they grow up to be a person that you don't value?

I suggest that this is a wonderful topic for a new thread (assuming one doesn't already exist).

[HaloNoble6]

If you valued the propagation of the human race?!? Is that even a concern in a time when people are starting movememts to make the human race extinct?!? I prefer my values to be personal--I would greatly enjoy seeing the kind of human I know I can create, not for propagating the human race, but for the very personal joy of watching a life grow guided by my own hand and example. It would take the right financial and romantic situation, though, not whether humans are scarce or in need of more live stock. LOL.

[JMeganSnow]

I would greatly enjoy seeing what the kind of human I know I could create, but it would take the right financial and romantic situation, not whether I valued the propagation of the human race.

Excuse me but this is a HORRIBLE REASON to have children AND why so many parent-children relationships are a freakin' nightmare. You don't have children in order to play god and mold unformed human clay. You have them because the process of watching them learn and grow and become adults gives you intensely personal enjoyment. Every man is ultimately responsible for his OWN character; if you tie this huge part of your personal energy into something that you have no control over, i.e. your children's eventual personality, you will reap nothing but misery and frustration.

If you need a concrete example to demonstrate this point, observe how many parents emotionally turn against their children when those children reach puberty and start to become independent; the parent-child relationship becomes an all-out power struggle with the child's very psychological survival as an independent being at stake.

The rational reason to have children would be that you like children, and not just really young kids, either, you should like teenagers too! (Mentally healthy teenagers are darling, btw.) Why would anyone like children? Because it's absolutely fascinating and wonderous to watch someone, with your support, come to comprehend the world one bit at a time. With this rational underpinning every iota of increased mental independence becomes a tribute to your support, your energy, your effort, not a denial of your failure to properly indoctrinate them into the right way of doing things.

(Oh, and thinking you can create someone else's character is determinism. Don't come back and say you didn't mean that, either, you know how to write so if you didn't "mean it that way" you shouldn't have said it.)

[HaloNoble6]

Um, Jen, I don't think I meant create in the way you took it to mean. Perhaps I forsaw it and hence elaborated on what I meant before you finished your scathing post.

Nevertheless, I should be clearer, substitute "create" above with "guide."

[JMeganSnow]

In that case my response is directed towards Proverb and studentofobjectivism; in the context of their statements I forgot that you could have just meant literal physical "creation" of another human being, my bad

[softwareNerd]

Here's the old thread where "why have children" was discussed.

[ChristopherSchlegel]

Ohboyohboyohboy ... A thread about kids! You guys are in trouble now

I rarely waste an opportunity like this. My wife & I had our first & probably only child 3 years ago this past week. His name is Ethan Aaron & because I am a very annoyingly doting father I am going to provide a link to some pix of him right here.

[HaloNoble6]

That is one hell of a cute kid.

[ChristopherSchlegel]

That is one hell of a cute kid.

Thanks, Felipe. As you can plainly see, his cuteness is due to mommy (i.e. golden blonde hair, bright blue eyes, beautiful smile) & not daddy. Although, he does have a bit of my wide nose & big mouth...when he is old enough to understand, I'll apologize.

[HaloNoble6]

You make sure to teach him a thing or two on guitar so he can get a girl as pretty as his mommy, now, you hear! Teach him some James Taylor!

[DavidOdden]

Well, if it's legal to post kid pix-linx, I gotta do what a grandfather is morally obliged to do.

[HaloNoble6]

"I found it outside. Want some?" LOL. Is that a grass snake she's holding? Man, she seems like she's going to be a headstrong girl.

Let's see more pictures of kids!

[ChristopherSchlegel]

Teach him some James Taylor! 

LOL! That was a good one, man. If one day he wants to know any JT tunes I will gladly show him. Right now his favorites are mostly songs from kiddie shows (i.e. "Blues Clues", "The Wiggles", etc.). So a lot of the time that's what I play for him when we are singing & goofing like in the pix.

He does love music. He really likes watching my Monkees DVDs & my "G3: Live in Denver". The problem is he favors Vai instead of Malmsteen! Ouch! I ask, "Wanna watch Yngwie?". Ethan replies, "No, daddy! Gonna watch Stevie Vai boogie!" Just recently we started "jamming" together for the first time. He has a little drum set in the living room. After watching some G3 he realized that he could play his drums while daddy played the guitar...just like the guys on the TV do! Man, that's good stuff.

...I gotta do what a grandfather is morally obliged to do.

Very good! So glad you did. Great pix, beautiful kid & perfect captions.

[A.West]

You want to see kid photos?

Here are a bunch of my 3 1/2 year old, mostly vacationing in China.

http://athena-realm.blogspot.com

[Proverb]

not whether humans are scarce or in need of more live stock. LOL.

I understand what you mean Felipe. The fact that I have the ability to procreate is not the reason to have kids though it is essential. I value this ability, thus I would fight to keep it (which would be on some medical front). The ability to create is a value, creating simply because you can is not.

I, like you, do not value 'human livestock' just to make that clear.

[studentofobjectivism]

  The problem is he favors Vai instead of Malmsteen!  Ouch!  I ask, "Wanna watch Yngwie?".  Ethan replies, "No, daddy!  Gonna watch Stevie Vai boogie!" 

You best smack some sense into that kid o' yo's! I hear that neo-classical, Super-arpeggiated, semi-demi-semiquaver note solos are all the rage with the kids these days.

[ChristopherSchlegel]

You best smack some sense into that kid o' yo's!

He already has an independent streak in him several miles wide!

I hear that neo-classical, Super-arpeggiated, semi-demi-semiquaver note solos are all the rage with the kids these days.   

LOL...Geez I only wish that were true. Seems like most of the pop music I've heard kids listen to now days barely has ANY melody at all, much less some blazing, glorious, brilliant melodic lines.

[Robspe]

I would like to know: what's the rational basis for having children? What if they grow up to be a person that you don't value?

I don't think having children is usually a rational decision. There's a powerful instinct at work there. But there are good results, like a whole heapin' helpin' of humility! But is it ever rational to have children? Sure. Learning is the purpose of life, as far as I can tell. And children are great teachers. I think wanting to learn is the ultimate expression of rationality.