Smh: Save My Head

[ycsmdafli]

Hey everyone, this past week I have been doing a lot of thinking. A lot of evaluating. I recently attended a wedding of a good friend of mine. The wedding was very beautiful, and the reception was fun. But I didn't know a lot of the people there. I was also the best man, so it made it even more strange, not knowing anyone and playing an "important role." That wasn't the real though, it came during the reception. The DJ played a song just for the newly weds, and they came out into the dance floor and started dancing. I could not help but to feel very lonely. Then this past week, a female friend of mine that I have known for some time now, was talking with me, we talked about a lot of things. All of which lead me to believe that she liked me, as more than just a friend that happened to be a guy. The next day I went to her house and I put chocolate kisses from her bed leading to her bathroom, and then tied a dozen roses to the shower head, with a little note. "Now that I have kissed the floor you walk on, and showered you with roses, would you be my girl?" She called me later that night.

She said that she liked me, and that she thinks that I am a great guy and all. Then she continued to say that she doesn't think that we should go out. When out of curiosity I asked the reasoning. She replied by saying that we would never last, that we could never be anything but friends. What I am wondering and can not understand is why. If we have things in common, we are physically attracted to each other and also share similar thoughts, and everything would lead you to believe we were all ready going out, in the manner we act toward each other and just like the connection that even others can tell exist. Why could we never be more than friends? Well if anyone has any advice or comments I am open to anything you have to say. Thanks.

[FeatherFall]

Nobody knows but her, so ask her out again. When she declines, demand to know why in a non-threatening and confident tone. Keep this up until she goes out with you, tells you why she won't, or stops talking to you. Hey, sometimes persistence wins out.

But if she tells you to stop then, seriously, you must stop.

Edited September 10, 2005 by FeatherFall

[BurgessLau]

I would suggest a different approach: Be grateful that she said "no." By doing so, she is saving you a lot of time. Don't waste time on her as a possible lover. She isn't. She said so. Assume she is a rational, honest adult and take her at her word.

Spend your time thinking about what you do want in life in terms of romance. Then set goals and work towards those goals. For example, meet a lot of women. Socialize further only with the ones who are both attractive to you and attracted to you. Cut the others out, as potential romantic partners. (One or two, however, might turn out to be lifetime friends, but don't mix the two.)

As an aside, I would recommend a more take-charge approach than kissing the ground a woman walks on. For example, select a simple activity you like and ask a prospect if she wants to go with you (you are going whether she does or not). She might make a counter-offer about which activity, but her interest or lack of it will be clear, one way or the other. Don't waste time on women who are not as strongly interested in you as you are in them.

[FeatherFall]

Burgess is right. Use a different approach. I've done some more thinking. My advice, before you read any more of this post, is to check The Morality of Sex with the Ideal Partner if you haven't already. It's one of the Recent Egosphere Entries list.

Now that you are done reading, ask yourself, do you really think your values match? If not, you are looking for the wrong woman.

If they do, consider some valid reasons for not dating you. Does she have her heart set on someone else? Does she think you hold values that run contrary to hers? Do you have a relationship that would be compromised by romantic interaction - for instance, do you have the same employer? Is she about to move away? You would know better than I, so do some thinking.

It helps to realize that she could have done it for the best reason. If ANY reason for not dating you could be valid, then you have to accept that. There is no use in wracking your mind over something you will not know definitively. This is something I've learned from experience.

However, if you don't like Burgess's advice, and you have evidence that she may be making the wrong decision and hurting herself for it, then proceed with the advice from my previous post. Again, do this ONLY if you have reason to believe that she is acting on reason, and that her reasoning is flawed.

Now I can go to bed knowing that my advice isn't completely faulty.

Edited September 10, 2005 by FeatherFall

[hunterrose]

And people said my theory was "common sense"

I agree with BurgessLau mostly, though I don't think her decision necessarily has to be accepted with gratitude and resignation.

The fact that she's declined means further pursuit likely won't change things, but understanding why she declined might be worthwhile.

If she misunderstood you (e.g. thought you didn't graduate, when you have) and based her decision on such misunderstandings, then obviously showing (not telling!) her that she mistook you would be advantageous.

If she declined because you're good but not good enough (e.g. she wanted a graduate, but you still have 6 months to go), then obviously you can make that improvement and then see what happens. If this improvement were something you were going to do or approve of doing regardless of her feelings on the matter, it's selfish/rational/justified.

If she just values different things than you (e.g. you're about to graduate, she wants a drop-out), then cut your "losses" and move on. Don't change who you are... just to attempt to impress another person.

On a lesser note:

- Finding out her reasons isn't the easiest thing in the world

- You're more likely to deduce or "observe" this girl's reasons than get an understandable answer from her. What she says sounded like a generic cop-out.

- Don't listen to everything a (lonely?) girl says at a wedding...

- Women IMO like such rosy/chocolatety acts, but such things won't ( or shouldn't...) change whether she likes you or not.

- Maybe you're pursuing her too hard? That can happen!

[Felix]

The next day I went to her house and I put chocolate kisses from her bed leading to her bathroom, and then tied a dozen roses to the shower head, with a little note. "Now that I have kissed the floor you walk on, and showered you with roses, would you be my girl?"

Even though this was well intended and romantic, you clearly overdid it. You were in a mood of romanticism and let your feeling run away with you. She wasn't prepared at all.

You went too far too early and that might have frightened her.

You said, she was a friend of yours, so you are in the 'friend box', not in the 'potential lover box'. Changing a friend into a lover is harder than changing a stranger into a lover, because you lose more if it doesn't work out.

You should clearly have taken way more time.

If you really believed that she wanted more, you should have met her more often and slowly moved her into seeing you as a potential lover.

As far as I see it, you just screwed this one up for both of you.

To really get her back you now need way way way way way more time, if it works out at all.

I'm really sorry to say that.

[hunterrose]

You went too far too early and that might have frightened her.

You said, she was a friend of yours, so you are in the 'friend box', not in the 'potential lover box'. Changing a friend into a lover is harder than changing a stranger into a lover, because you lose more if it doesn't work out.

As far as I see it, you just screwed this one up for both of you.

To really get her back you now need way way way way way more time, if it works out at all...

Argh, it's not that bad, is it?

Assuming pursuing the romance isn't warranted, and that she was sincere in considering you a friend, all is not lost in terms of the friendship. And you never "had her" in the romantic relationship sense so just keep being a friend, act like the proposition never happened, and you're back where you started

I personally don't believe you risk the friendship by attempting to shift a person from the "friend box" to "lover box," so long as you know when to give up the effort.

[Felix]

I personally don't believe you risk the friendship by attempting to shift a person from the "friend box" to "lover box," so long as you know when to give up the effort.

You misunderstood me.

Let me state this clearer. It was hard for her to make that shift, so she didn't.

The friendship is still safe if it was before.

What I meant was the chance to become her boyfriend, which was his stated goal.

I would advise trying to switch back to normal, too.

[JMeganSnow]

She replied by saying that we would never last, that we could never be anything but friends.

Speaking as a female sort, she is probably right about this. (Not that there's anything wrong with you.) Most likely there is something about you that rubs her completely the wrong way, and it's big enough that it would eventually cause a relationship to disintegrate. This, btw, is how men "scare women off" by "going too fast". If she didn't have serious concerns about you, she would have found your gesture entirely charming. Women are not crazy people that don't know what they want and have to be taught. The trouble is that most of us don't expect to ever FIND what we want (and if we do, we assume that we don't deserve it, anyway). Some of us will put up with even destructive relationships.

If you keep pushing, even gently, she will probably give in, wondering if maybe the factor that she detected wasn't as big a deal as she thought, or that you will "grow out" of it, or maybe she can "put up" with it. You will have a relationship for a while, during which she will fight herself not to notice what she already disliked, and increasingly fail; then (depending on your personalities) you will either just drift apart or have a spectacular, ugly breakup.

One caveat: I have not, personally, known many gentleman to be good at getting rid of traits that I considered negative, but it is possible. That's the only way you're going to have a good romantic relationship. I won't advise you how to act: the way men pursue romance is quite a bit different from the way women go about it, at least that I've seen. Just be aware of what you'd be getting in to.

P.S. Taking a wild guess here, the thing she probably dislikes about you is that you aren't "mature" or "serious" enough for her.

[ycsmdafli]

P.S. Taking a wild guess here, the thing she probably dislikes about you is that you aren't "mature" or "serious" enough for her.

Well as it is right now, we met at my work... She was apllying for a job as a waitress, and I was the manager that did the interview. She ended up not getting the job because the schedual conflicted with her other job. But we sayed in touch and she would come in after work to get somethign to eat. Well we had been friends for about 6 months. Seeing eachother outside of work, and played eachothers dates to numerous events, such as weddings, work socials, ect. and we shared many nights, stayin up, and talking about religion, politics, books.

So that is why I thought we would go good together. But I have to say that she is the more imature one, out of us. But not that much, she is still a great girl. For whatever it is worth.

[JMeganSnow]

But I have to say that she is the more imature one, out of us. But not that much, she is still a great girl. For whatever it is worth.

That doesn't mean that she doesn't think you're immature. I said it was a wild guess. It's possible she thinks you're too much of a stuffy old fogey for her