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What kind of music do you enjoy?

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AshRyan
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Isn't Toohey's last speech just the embodiment of sheer evil that rivals Kant? ::shudders::

His remarks concerning mediocrity in the arts certainly make me shudder. Reduce what is great by elevating the merely good, or ideally the downright awful.

On the subject of 'God as bastard', I've always loved Newman's work. He actually wrote an updated musical version of Goethe's Faust, where Faust becomes a spoilt, petulant student who signs away his soul almost out of boredom. God is presented as vain and preening, while the devil is the ultimate cynic poking endless fun at the grandiosity of heaven.

And on that note, I've been reading Christopher Hitchens' Letters to a Young Contrarian, which contains the following choice passge on the subject of religion:

"I touched on the threat of hell with which the devout have always reinforced their ostensibly kindly recommendations, but just consider for a moment what their heaven looks like. Endless praise and adoration, limitless abnegation and abjection of self; a celestial North Korea."

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I have absolutely no idea who most of the "bands" or performers are. But I am well versed in Bach, Brahms, Beethoven, Rachmaninov, Chopin, et al.

Bach in particular is interesting. Objectivists seem to avoid Bach as if their very life were in danger. Why is that? Is it that he's just simply not liked or is it because he did write some religious music?

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...I am well versed in Bach, Brahms, Beethoven, Rachmaninov, Chopin, et al.

Excellent! My absolute favorite is Beethoven. Do you have a particular favorite? Are you a musician?

Objectivists seem to avoid Bach as if their very life were in danger.

Upon what is that claim based?

I know from my private & school study of Bach he was a first-rate musical mind. But that doesn't change the fact that I do not personally like certain aspects of his music (i.e. his voice leading choices, wandering baroque harmonic structures, overly ornamental phrasing, etc.). I recognize it is a personal choice/optional value.

Beethoven also wrote "religious music". I enjoy it in spite of that association. :D

In fact of the limited Bach I do like would be parts of "St. Matthew Passion".

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So, what kind of music does everyone here enjoy?

I listen to some classical, especially Rachmoninoff and Tchaikovsky.  One of my favorite radio programs is a show called From The Top which showcases young (18 and under) classical musicians.  The host is a pianist named Christopher O'Riley who's very good, and plays a lot of Rachmoninoff (who is also his favorite composer).

I also listen to a lot of film music.  My favorite film composer is Danny Elfman, but I have scores by many different composers.

I've always loved Mozart, but I'd have to say my favorite classical composer is Rachmaninoff, but Tchaikovsky is somewhere in there as well. I also like film music (Elfman is great, edward scissor hands being one of the best scores I can think of) Craig Armstrong, John Williams.

I love Prog-rock (which if you don't know, is a more produced thought-out genre of music, emphasizing skill with instruments vs. garage rock). I like way too many bands but some of my ultimate faves: David Bowie, Built to Spill, ELO, new order, Nico, Queen, Royksopp, Scissor sisters, Supertramp, Talking Heads, t-rex, and Todd Rundgren.

The Velvet Underground has to be in there somewhere with Iggy Pop even though I can't really listen to most of their songs anymore.

I'm also a big fan of jazz, but only a select few: James Carter, Duke Ellington, Charles Mingus

I don't know where to put Dean Martin but I just love him.

and probably my favorite lyricist of all time and fellow atheist Randy Newman.

Man, I always go way overboard when people ask me this question.

I can't believe I forgot Stevie Ray Vaughan and Charlie parker (thanks Mark C. for reminding me)

Edited by Michero
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Excellent!  My absolute favorite is Beethoven.  Do you have a particular favorite?  Are you a musician?

Upon what is that claim based?

I know from my private & school study of Bach he was a first-rate musical mind.  But that doesn't change the fact that I do not personally like certain aspects of his music (i.e. his voice leading choices, wandering baroque harmonic structures, overly ornamental phrasing, etc.).  I recognize it is a personal choice/optional value.

Beethoven also wrote "religious music".  I enjoy it in spite of that association.  :D

In fact of the limited Bach I do like would be parts of "St. Matthew Passion".

I am a muscian, although I don't play anymore.

I'd have to say that TODAY, my favorite composer is probably J. Brahms. But in truth I have many favorites, it's akin to picking your favorite star in the sky. Brahms is often described as "dark", but I hear it as "dark chocolate", thick towering hamonies and DEFIANT. THe Brahms Clairent Qunitet is a gigantic work, the second movement is some of the most searingly beautiful music I've ever heard.

I like Beethoven, especially all the piano works and quartets. And I do love Bach, the Chacone from the Partita No2 for solo violin is astounding! The concerto's, organ works, wonderful. Did you know the first 2 movements (Kyrie and Gloria) of the B-minor mass were written as a job application?

I base my comments about other Objectivists not liking Bach on comments like yours...you don't like it. :) Or at least you don't like much of it. I've heard these comments many times over the years and haven't been able to put my finger on the why of it. Perhaps it is my training, but I think any deep understanding of what took place musically in the 19th century must be based on a firm understanding of what happened in the 17th and 18th centuries...especially a deep understanding of Bach. In my opinion, and I stress this is just MY opinion, Bach is the cornerstone of modern western music. (Modern meaning the time since the Age of Reason, not modern in the sense of John Cage.)

Plus I do think it takes proper training and the development of listening skills to hear Bach properly. But I think it takes those skills to hear most any composer properly. Most people seem to regard listening to music as a mindless thing that doesn't require any effort. For example, I counted a few weeks ago, the number of CD's in the local music store devoted to things like "Music for Reading" and "Music for Friends" and "Music for Lovers" and "Music to trim the Verge by"! There were over 30 such titles! Now I do unerstand why music companies make such releases, but it does say something about the culture. Personally I think it is a lack of musical training brought about by the utter destruction of classical music...AS SUCH....by philosophers and their lap dogs, the modern academic composer! I damn them all!

Now, if you require an example, I submit "Opera Babes"! Yes, you read it right, "Opera Babes'! Go get a a recording of the great Renata Trebaldi singing one of the most beautiful aria's ever written, "Un bel di" and compare that to what the "Opera Babes" did to it in 2002. It's like someone re-writing "Atlas Shrugged" and leaving out all the verbs!

But back to my point, for me at least, listening to music is something that requires intense concentration...it require EFFORT! If people made love the way they listen to music the world would be depopulated in a decade!

I don't know much about the "pop" music scene, perhaps you can recommend something. I've been studying so called "classical" music almost 40 years and I still don't have it all down. There's always one more thing to learn, one more composition I haven't heard. But, the field is dying and rightly so, at least in it's current form. But what my friend will replace it?

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Bach in particular is interesting. Objectivists seem to avoid Bach as if their very life were in danger. Why is that? Is it that he's just simply not liked or is it because he did write some religious music?

He's my favorite.

Also, Toccata and Fugue in D Minor is always my example of "a great work of art, but I don't like it."

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I am a muscian, although I don't play anymore.

What was your primary instrument? Did you play classical?

I'd have to say that TODAY, my favorite composer is probably J. Brahms.

Wonderful!

I like Beethoven, especially all the piano works and quartets.

What's not to like?! :)

I base my comments about other Objectivists not liking Bach on comments like yours...you don't like it.  :huh: Or at least you don't like much of it. I've heard these comments many times over the years and haven't been able to put my finger on the why of it.

I can only speak for myself here. I know why I don't & it has to do with very specific technical musical details & not any religious association. This is also not something I have personally encountered: i.e. hearing first-hand from any large sample of Objectivists that they dislike Bach. Apparently you have though & that's interesting. Can you think of any possible reasons based on what you have observed (aside from the religious component)?

In my opinion, and I stress this is just MY opinion, Bach is the cornerstone of modern western music. (Modern meaning the time since the Age of Reason, not modern in the sense of John Cage.)

Absolutely, I agree.

Plus I do think it takes proper training and the development of listening skills to hear Bach properly. But I think it takes those skills to hear most any composer properly. Most people seem to regard listening to music as a mindless thing that doesn't require any effort.

I suppose that would depend a great deal upon how you would define 'proper training'. In a general sense, a mind does of course need to be trained to be able to effectively understand/deal with reality. But are you saying people need to understand rudimentary music theory in order to effectively listen to Bach, or something like this? Or am I misunderstanding your point here?

Personally I think it is a lack of musical training brought about by the utter destruction of classical music...AS SUCH....by philosophers and their lap dogs, the modern academic composer! I damn them all!

I can certainly appreciate your passion on this issue.

Now, if you require an example...

I require no examples; I know how right you are that much music (& art in general) is in a dismal position in our current culture.

But back to my point, for me at least, listening to music is something that requires intense concentration...it require EFFORT!

True; this is a good point.

There's always one more thing to learn, one more composition I haven't heard. But, the field is dying and rightly so, at least in it's current form. But what my friend will replace it?

Right HERE, Pytheus! I am trying! I'm giving it all I got.

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What was your primary instrument?  Did you play classical?

Wonderful!

What's not to like?!  :lol:

I can only speak for myself here.  I know why I don't & it has to do with very specific technical musical details & not any religious association.  This is also not something I have personally encountered:  i.e. hearing first-hand from any large sample of Objectivists that they dislike Bach.  Apparently you have though & that's interesting.  Can you think of any possible reasons based on what you have observed (aside from the religious component)?

Absolutely, I agree.

I suppose that would depend a great deal upon how you would define 'proper training'.  In a general sense, a mind does of course need to be trained to be able to effectively understand/deal with reality. But are you saying people need to understand rudimentary music theory in order to effectively listen to Bach, or something like this?  Or am I misunderstanding your point here?

I can certainly appreciate your passion on this issue.

I require no examples; I know how right you are that much music (& art in general) is in a dismal position in our current culture.

True; this is a good point.

Right HERE, Pytheus!  I am trying!  I'm giving it all I got.

My primary instrument was clarinet, although my primary interest was conducting. Since I was about 6 years old, "classical" music is the only type that's really held any interest for me. Learning other songs or popular music was nice when it came to meeting girls, but beyond that it bored me quickly. :lol: And I rather expected the girls to "keep up" with my level of thinking but most didn't have the bulk for serious musical thought. (I do admit I have met and know some excellent female musicians.)

What I mean by "proper training" is how to concentrate or focus your attention and how to listen for the different "voices". That's one reason I like to use examples from Bach when teaching this to others. Simple fuges are great tools for sharpening listen skills and demonstrating how a theme or melody is passed from voice to voice and molded and modified in the process. Of course this is utterly impossible with someone like Jon Cage! And though I do not consider film music an art, I do think it can be useful in teaching.

I think music thoery as such can be helpful, but it's not a prerequiste or even necessary in the appreciation of music. That is more of a concern to the composer. I'm much more in line with the thinking of Aristoxenus on this issue.

I'd say more, and perhaps will later, but I'm late for a dinner enagement.

Regards,

Pytheus

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Christopher,

I just got back in and realized you had a link in your last post. I checked it out. Indeed you are doing something. <applause>

I listened to a few selections. I fully admit the instrumentation shook me some, but that's because I'm simply not accustomed to it.

I just may have to place an order and become more aquainted with this music! :lol:

Bravo!

Pytheus

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My primary instrument was clarinet, although my primary interest was conducting...

Thanks for the personal info & insightful reply.

What I mean by "proper training" is how to concentrate or focus your attention and how to listen for the different "voices".

OK, I can see how Bach inventions & fugues (i.e. or any form of good contrapunctal writing for example) would fit this approach. I gather from your reply you are referring more to a general education method of teaching a mind how to function properly, not solely for the pupose of listening to (& appreciating) music.

I just got back in and realized you had a link in your last post. I checked it out. Indeed you are doing something. <applause>

Thank you. :thumbsup:

I listened to a few selections. I fully admit the instrumentation shook me some, but that's because I'm simply not accustomed to it.

Hmmm...? Perhaps you are referring to the electric guitar (or pop tunes?) as regards being "shook" by the instrumentation? I have a wide variety of genres & timbres in which I work. I am going to make the assumption at this point you would probably appreciate my romantic/classical work more than anything else (symphonic pieces, string quartets, etc.).

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Thanks for the personal info & insightful reply.

OK, I can see how Bach inventions & fugues (i.e. or any form of good contrapunctal writing for example) would fit this approach.  I gather from your reply you are referring more to a general education method of teaching a mind how to function properly, not solely for the pupose of listening to (& appreciating) music.

Thank you.  :lol:

Hmmm...?  Perhaps you are referring to the electric guitar (or pop tunes?) as regards being "shook" by the instrumentation?  I have a wide variety of genres & timbres in which I work.  I am going to make the assumption at this point you would probably appreciate my romantic/classical work more than anything else (symphonic pieces, string quartets, etc.).

The short answer...yes. Teaching a mind how to function properly in general is a good way to put it. When I was a young lad we had "general" music class that involved basic part singing, some instrumentation, rythmics, etc...When I studied music at the college level music appreciation was a joke. It didn't have to be, but it was. This might have changed by now, but judging from the general state of the culture I'd say it hasn't.

I remember a funny story from my college days. An older female composer friend of mine asked me to conduct her first major piece, "Engima" for chamber orchestra. Of course as I student my mentor, Dr. Joe Barry Mullins, told me to conduct two dogs barking if I could get them to sit still long enough just to gain experience. So I agreed and she gave me the score. I'm flipping through it and ask her quite seriously what the melody was supposed to be. She replied, equally serious, that melody was dead! I didn't know melody had died! This was shocking. Had the media been alerted? Was there an investigation? Of course it was until some years later that I learned of the culprit.

I conducted the "thing"! And it was a learning experience in many respects. But UGHH! I looked her up a few years ago, and she's now a member of a Bi/Gay/Lesbian/Transgender music association in a major American city. "Engima" was the right choice for a title! :nuke:

P.S. We are no longer in contact. :(

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  • 4 weeks later...
I've kept this to myself for many years, but this thread prompts me to reveal that the Concerto of Deliverance was written in this world by Jon Sebelius, and its called the Fifth Symphony.

There is a recent work that was explicitly based on and inspired by Rand's description of "the Concerto of Deliverance". It was commissioned to commemorate the Rand Centenary. Lots of excerpts and info is at http://www.starshipaurora.com/concertoofdeliverance.html

Later, search here at OO for the thread last year that discussed the production of this album.

- Monart

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Of course not! Bjork is one of the great, underrated singers of recent decades.

But I think it might be a mistake to group her in the genre of Air, etc. Although the musical accompaniment to her songs is usually "electronic," I think the emphasis is on the voice. So I would group her in with other "Vocal Artists," such as Patsy Cline, Nancy Sinatra, Judy Garland, Kate Bush, etc.

Not that there are objective standards for establishing genre, that's just my interpretation of reducing the issue to fundamentals...

I gather I'm the only Bjork fan? ;)

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I love Prog-rock (which if you don't know, is a more produced thought-out genre of music, emphasizing skill with instruments vs. garage rock).  I like way too many bands but some of my ultimate faves:  David Bowie, Built to Spill,  ELO, new order, Nico, Queen, Royksopp, Scissor sisters, Supertramp, Talking Heads, t-rex, and Todd Rundgren.

I liked the Todd of the Seventies . . .

and probably my favorite lyricist of all time and fellow atheist Randy Newman.

Being short, I never took a shine to Randy Newman . . . :)

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  • 2 weeks later...
Chicane's Saltwater(original) anyone?

Brilliant track! I'm an avid electronic music fan and listener. My favorite genres are deep house, trance, funky techno/tech house, and breaks.

I generally enjoy going to clubs/parties despite the many downsides of that culture (i.e. the nihilistic, collectivistic, drug crazed aspects). However, I've been involved in the Toronto club/electronic music scene for years and I've met many wonderfully benevolent people who just love life.

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  • 1 month later...
  • 2 weeks later...

For people who like Prog Rock check out Coheed and Cambria.

They are fast becoming one of my favorite bands.

They are great musicians, their vocals are really great (I love Claudio's high range) , and they do concept albums.

Their albums all follow a comic book story that was written by the lead singer and has been illustrated in a big graphic novel and two comic books.

I HIGHLY recommend checking out Coheed and Cambria.

Here are some links.

1) If you have a fast connection, I HIGHLY recommend clicking this link and watching their music videos...first "Welcome Home" and then "The Suffering."

2) If you want music only, check out http://www.myspace.com/coheedandcambria

I recommend listening to "Welcome Home" and then "The Suffering."

"The Suffering" is the radio friendly poppy single and it is cool, but Welcome Home is just really cool.

Edited by Tryptonique
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For people who like Prog Rock check out Coheed and Cambria.

I've really gotten into them in the past six months. I usually listen to "In Keeping Secrets with Silent Earth 3" about twice a month (in fact I think it's getting close to that time again). They're just really catchy, and still musically talented. I wouldn't mind hearing a bit more from the drums, but that's just personal bias on my part.

I didn't know that about the comic book thing that. That puts things into a new perspective.

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