Jump to content
Objectivism Online Forum

Venezuela: Chavez begins nationalizing

Rate this topic


bobsponge
 Share

Recommended Posts

Ahhh, banks are pretty much already nationalized -- see: Federal Reserve.

Anyways, Chavez is an actual socialist. He put the means of production under the control of the government. Democrats don't do this, nor will they probably ever with the exception of some aspects of the medical system (but, they won't make it illegal to practive private medicine). A high tax rate is not socialism, regulations on certain items to make them "safer" is not socialism. Socialistic, but not socialism, and people who advocate those things aren't socialists.

Having government completely control the means of production or the "public" control the means of production instead of private individiuals, that's socialism.

You are right, of course. Means of production nominally in private hands but the government is tilting the deck with controls. These are the hallmarks of fascism rather than socialism. Canada is further along this road than is the USA. Canada is deeply into socialist territory with its socialized health care, fascist in many other areas.

I certainly hope no Objectivist gases up at Citgo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 months later...
  • Replies 58
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Chavez has continued his winning steak, just announcing that he's nationalizing all gasoline distribution.

CARACAS: President Hugo Chávez said that wholesale gasoline sales by private companies in Venezuela will soon disappear after his congressional allies pass a bill nationalizing the business...

Distributors, including subsidiaries of British Petroleum, Exxon Mobil and Chevron, had hoped to persuade the government not to seize total control of their businesses. But Chávez ruled out allowing private minority stakes, accusing operators on Wednesday of making money at the country's expense....

The law gives distributors 60 days to negotiate the sale of their businesses to the government or face expropriation. It also forces distributors to sell storage tanks and gasoline pumps to Petróleos de Venezuela and to relinquish their brand names.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/28/business/fuel.php

I love the way the government gives the businesses time to "negotiate" the "sale" of their assets to the government. When they stick a gun in your face, the negotiations probably go pretty well for the party holding the gun. We can only hope that this results in gasoline shortages.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ahhh, banks are pretty much already nationalized -- see: Federal Reserve.

Bluntly put, you've no idea what you're talking about. You ought to try living in a country with nationalized banks and see the difference.

Take the case of Mexico. President Lopez Portillo nationalized the banks on September 1st. 1982 (except Citibank). The next day he ordered all Dollar accounts turned to pesos at a rate of 70 pesos to the dollar. Then he devalued the peso again to around 100 per dollar. Then of course came controls on withdrawls and currency exchange, lest capital fly to where it would be safe from legalized theft.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
  • 2 months later...

Low oil prices have made Chavez put his tail between his legs. Now he's even inviting Western oil companies back to Venezuela to help boost production. If any oil company has management that is dumb enough to think they can depend on an agreement with this thug, their shareholders should revolt.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/01/15/america/15venez.php

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If the Exxon execs had any balls at all they should have rigged their facilities with explosives and blasted them sky-high as soon as Chavez's thugs arrived.

That's what I would have done.

If nationalization happens in the US as AceNZ asked, oil companies would surely be a likely candidate. But banks might be first, after all, and the nationalization might be a Trojan-horse-style takeover starting with, for example, the subprime bailouts.

How prophetic, you were proven right.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...
Too bad the Canadians won't go down there and teach this guy a lesson in property rights.

The Crystallex mine nationalization did not even make the news in Canada from what I have seen. I guess the leftist media are shilling for their guy Chavez, even up here in Soviet Canuckistan.

Chavez should be ordered to immediately reverse the theft of this mine. If he fails to comply, the mine should be destroyed, diplomatic relations with Venezuela should be severed, and a complete economic embargo should be initiated against Venezuela.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He's already talking to some of the companies about allowing them back. (And it's not like these companies aren't faced with this same situation everywhere they do business (including the US), so why sabatoge one place and not all the rest?)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Chavez has now successfully engineered his presidency-for-life scenario, similar to Castro. Strange that we've not heard a peep from the Obama administration about any of this. I guess it's part of the master plan to increase our stature in the world by not offending dictators. :confused:

Venezuelans yesterday voted to abolish term limits for elected officials, boosting Hugo Chávez's ambition to rule the country for decades. Electoral authorities said 54% of voters in the referendum backed a constitutional amendment allowing indefinite re-election, with 46% rejecting it – a margin of almost 1 million voters. An exultant Chávez appeared on the balcony of the presidential palace in Caracas to address cheering supporters after the result was announced. "It is a clear victory for the people," he said. "It is a clear victory for the revolution."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/feb/1...indefinite-rule

Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...9021601468.html

Venezuela's referendum Sunday on whether to amend a constitution less than a decade old to allow President Hugo Chávez to run for office indefinitely is just the latest example. Two other South American countries have embarked in the past decade on rewriting their societies' fundamental rules, creating enormous new charters that vastly expand the social and economic rights granted to citizens, particularly the poor.

In all three cases, from the Venezuelan charter in 1999 to the new constitutions in Ecuador last year and Bolivia last month, a team of Spanish legal scholars influenced the conception, drafting or implementation of the documents, which have stirred domestic class tensions and harmed relations with the U.S. government. The leader is Roberto Viciano Pastor, an author and constitutional law professor at the University of Valencia whose technical, and some say ideological, assistance in writing the constitutions is generating new scrutiny across South America.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The leader is Roberto Viciano Pastor, an author and constitutional law professor at the University of Valencia whose technical, and some say ideological, assistance in writing the constitutions is generating new scrutiny across South America.

A leftist, religionist, college professor.... he has three strikes against him. If there were ever anyone who deserved to live under the horrors of socialism, I'd say this guy would take the prize.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sad day today.

Our best hope for a place in which to live in freedom, the USofA, just hit a new low:

The United States Tuesday welcomed Venezuela's "civic" referendum lifting term limits for the president and all politicians, but urged support for democracy and tolerance in the country.

"We congratulate the civic and participatory spirit of the millions of Venezuelans who exercized their democratic right to vote," State Department spokesman Noel Clay told AFP.

It continues:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CN...;show_article=1

They are going to play this on the state owned TV stations of leftist dictatorships for years to come. Thank God at least the President didn't say it himself, or it would've been decades.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

President Hugo Chavez on Friday warned Venezuela's largest food producer that its entire operations could soon be expropriated amid a personal spat between Chavez and its president.

...

"I'm going to take away all of Polar from you, down to the last plant you have," Chavez said in a televised speech.

...

Chavez has accused Polar and other companies of evading price caps on basic foodstuffs by producing less of those items, flouting new regulations that require price-controlled items to comprise at least 70 percent of their output. The rules aim to inflation, with food prices soaring 40.1 percent in Caracas and annual inflation reaching 30.1 percent last year, the highest in Latin America.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2009/03/07/...zuela-Polar.php

Strange, isn't it? Now they have socialism but somehow the prices skyrocket. While it's sad to see the country to break down even more, it's nice to see reality at work.

I wonder if there is a way to sue Chavez for stealing the idea of the looters in Atlas Shrugged... And I wonder what Chavez would say if Polar burned down all its plants...

With all these expropriations going on I wonder what honest businessman would want to invest in Venezuela.

"Justice does exist in the world, whether people choose to practice it or not. The men of ability are being avenged. The avenger is reality. Its weapon is slow, silent, invisible, and men perceive it only by its consequences — by the gutted ruins and the moans of agony it leaves in its wake. The name of the weapon is: inflation." Ayn Rand

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Chavez continues to nationalize foreign owned businesses:

CARACAS (Reuters) - Venezuela will go ahead with the nationalization of the local unit of Spanish bank Grupo Santander, President Hugo Chavez said on Thursday, weeks after officials said the purchase was on hold.

Since first winning office a decade ago, Chavez has nationalized large swathes of the OPEC nation's economy and this year has moved to increase state control of farms and food production despite a sharp drop in oil income.

"We are not retreating. Today we have returned to the subject, I announce the nationalization of Banco de Venezuela to strengthen the national public banking system," Chavez said during a televised meeting with ministers.

http://www.reuters.com/article/ousiv/idUSTRE52J0BS20090320

Too bad no country has the balls to go down to Caracas, stick a gun in this guy's face and teach him the meaning of property rights.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Too bad no country has the balls to go down to Caracas, stick a gun in this guy's face and teach him the meaning of property rights.

Too bad no country supported the coup that ousted Chavez a few years back, and that includes America.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chavez has now seized all airports and shipping ports, and is leveling a federal tax on their usage. He says he has to do this because revenue is falling off due to lower prices for oil products. He is also raising taxes across the board.

I think all his thievery is breaking the economy of his country, but at least one person is naming the right principle:

"They're not using reason, they're using force," Chavez opponent Eliseo Fermin, head of Zulia state's legislative council, said Saturday.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 9 months later...

Chavez is now threatening Toyota, Fiat and GM with nationalization of their plants in Venezuela:

The populist leader has threatened to expropriate Toyota Motor Corp.'s local assembly plant if the Japanese car maker doesn't produce more vehicles designed for rural areas and transfer new technologies and manufacturing methods to its local unit. He said other car companies were also guilty of not transferring enough technology, mentioning Fiat SpA of Italy, which controls Chrysler Group LLC, and General Motors Co.

The president ordered his trade minister, Eduardo Saman, to inspect the Toyota plant. He said if the inspection shows Toyota isn't producing what he thinks it should and isn't transferring technology, the government may consider taking over its plant and have a Chinese company operate it.

"We'll take it, we'll expropriate it, we'll pay them what it is worth and immediately call on the Chinese," Mr. Chávez said in a televised address late Wednesday.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405...0386867578.html

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...