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Sometimes you feel like a nut ... sometimes you don’t

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I have read this text, what do you think about ?

"Sometimes you feel like a nut ... sometimes you don’t

We women often have trouble distinguishing our inner voice from our inner critic. Frequently, a woman's inner critic doesn't give her permission to follow her instincts if they run counter to a man’s. Some women have been socialized to be cautious of acting differently from the way a man expects them to — especially in dating situations. As a result, women often chicken out of potentially successful negotiations with men.

A woman once told me a story that illustrates this point nicely. Her boyfriend took her to a movie and-bought a big bag of peanut M&Ms "to share." The woman had told him previously that she was allergic to nuts, but she chose not to remind him: instead, she just carefully ate off the chocolate and spit out the peanuts.

Quite a romantic evening, huh? The story may sound funny, but I find it sad. Wanting to please a man you care about isn't sad, but not wanting to demonstrate separateness is. This woman imagined that expressing her individuality would threaten her boyfriend (note that she seemed to have no trouble telling her preferences to an¬other woman).In fact, most men aren’t bothered by such expressions, but rather appreciate your ability to express your preferences.

Imagining that any expression of your own needs will create a problem is sad. Research indicates that men want to be appreciated. So why do we women back out of telling them what we want? Why do we give in before even trying to negotiate? We say, "Do what you want; it’s okay." The im¬plied message is "What I want isn't important." Gloria Steinem points out that we are empathy sick — we have walked in someone else’s shoes so much that we've forgotten how to fill our own. You need to do unto yourself as you would do for others. Start listening to your inner voice to find out what it is that you want — not what you think others expect."

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I am not sure that I understand what you want to know. The quote above seems to be a bit of a convoluted way of saying "second-handed". If a woman "never wanted anything for herself" and all that garbage, I'd just call he Mrs. Keating and be on my way. Some of the details, though, confuse the issue. For example, I'm a man, and if a girl brought me peanut m&m's and I was allergic, I doubt I would say anything either. The gesture was nice, I could still enjoy the chocolate, it's not a big deal so I wouldn't bring it up. Nothing to gain by being bitchy about it. If I was deathly allergic, I would certainly make sure that she knew at some future time. Wouldn't want her to make dinner for me and cook something in peanut oil, but as usual, the context is important.

So sure you should introspect and know what you want. But I would recommend obsessing about every little whim or issue either.

Edited by aequalsa
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What is bitchy or not appreciative about kindly saying: "Love to have some but I am allergic." How can that be threatening?

I wouldn't call it threatening. Ok...another example...If I were invited to dinner and someone had the audacity to serve me fungus(mushrooms...ack!) I would not turn it down or make a fuss, I'd just eat it. It seems uninteresting or sometimes even impolite to make an ordeal out of minor issues. That's all I meant by it. Part of my "don't sweat the small stuff" approcah to life.

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I have a friend who was taught that eating is unfeminine. As a result (and a result of some other things) she barely touches food on a date. She sees it as animalistic. (I find this especially funny, because I myself can sometimes eat with no manners at all, people or no people around. I find the difference of me speaking to my date with my mouth stuffed and her starving the entire evening funny).

Her brother on the other hand, feels perfectly natural to be vulgar: he was taught that he is a guy, and a guy should feel comfortable being "animalistic".

So there might be an education-based difference between men and women in some families. Don't know how common this is.

Edited by ifatart
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Frequently, a woman's inner critic doesn't give her permission to follow her instincts if they run counter to a man’s. Some women have been socialized to be cautious of acting differently from the way a man expects them to — especially in dating situations. As a result, women often chicken out of potentially successful negotiations with men.

...

Imagining that any expression of your own needs will create a problem is sad. Research indicates that men want to be appreciated. So why do we women back out of telling them what we want? Why do we give in before even trying to negotiate? We say, "Do what you want; it’s okay." The im¬plied message is "What I want isn't important." Gloria Steinem points out that we are empathy sick — we have walked in someone else’s shoes so much that we've forgotten how to fill our own. You need to do unto yourself as you would do for others. Start listening to your inner voice to find out what it is that you want — not what you think others expect."

I understand the feeling that they're trying to describe (at least I think I do.) However, I don't think it's as second-handed as it sounds. There have been lots of cases where I have set aside what I would want in another context because the man I love wants something different. I see this as acting to keep a higher value - my man - rather than sacrificing my particular preference of a movie. There are also plenty of cases where I make sure he knows what I want.

I also seriously wouldn't call it 'chickening out of potentially successful negotiations with men' or being 'cautious of acting different from the way a man expects them to.' I'm sure there are women who do that sort of thing, but that's a different beast than ignoring some of my own (minor) preferences in favor of his. Besides, I expect him to do the same "for me" once in a while, because I expect him to care about what I want. It's a give-and-take thing. If he always insists on having his way, what kind of relationship is that? I do think women value the relationship itself more than men do, so my guess is women do this sort of thing more often, but at least for me it's because the things I give up aren't things I care that much about, and it's often worth it just to see him smile. Kind of like offering the last cookie to your best friend even though you'd like to eat it but you know it's her facorite kind. You just value the person more than the cookie. Sometimes she'll offer it right back, but you insist; sometimes she'll offer the cookie back and you'll accept, because you figure she works the same way you do.

Maybe they're talking about something a little more serious than what I'm talking about. I don't really know.

And obviously if you're doing that sort of thing because you think it's expected of you instead of the reason I use, there's a couple problems there.

Frequently, a woman's inner critic doesn't give her permission to follow her instincts if they run counter to a man’s. Some women have been socialized to be cautious of acting differently from the way a man expects them to — especially in dating situations. As a result, women often chicken out of potentially successful negotiations with men.

...

Imagining that any expression of your own needs will create a problem is sad. Research indicates that men want to be appreciated. So why do we women back out of telling them what we want? Why do we give in before even trying to negotiate? We say, "Do what you want; it’s okay." The im¬plied message is "What I want isn't important." Gloria Steinem points out that we are empathy sick — we have walked in someone else’s shoes so much that we've forgotten how to fill our own. You need to do unto yourself as you would do for others. Start listening to your inner voice to find out what it is that you want — not what you think others expect."

I understand the feeling that they're trying to describe (at least I think I do.) However, I don't think it's as second-handed as it sounds. There have been lots of cases where I have set aside what I would want in another context because the man I love wants something different. I see this as acting to keep a higher value - my man - rather than sacrificing my particular preference of a movie. There are also plenty of cases where I make sure he knows what I want.

I also seriously wouldn't call it 'chickening out of potentially successful negotiations with men' or being 'cautious of acting different from the way a man expects them to.' I'm sure there are women who do that sort of thing, but that's a different beast than ignoring some of my own (minor) preferences in favor of his. Besides, I expect him to do the same "for me" once in a while, because I expect him to care about what I want. It's a give-and-take thing. If he always insists on having his way, what kind of relationship is that? I do think women value the relationship itself more than men do, so my guess is women do this sort of thing more often, but at least for me it's because the things I give up aren't things I care that much about, and it's often worth it just to see him smile. Kind of like offering the last cookie to your best friend even though you'd like to eat it but you know it's her facorite kind. You just value the person more than the cookie. Sometimes she'll offer it right back, but you insist; sometimes she'll offer the cookie back and you'll accept, because you figure she works the same way you do.

Maybe they're talking about something a little more serious than what I'm talking about. I don't really know.

And obviously if you're doing that sort of thing because you think it's expected of you instead of the reason I use, there's a couple problems there.

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  • 1 month later...

It's a give-and-take thing. :thumbsup:

I used to find it irritating when a woman doesn't speak up about such things. Especially during early dating. How else are you going to know?

The last thing any rational person would want is to make someone, they are interested in, is to feel uncomfortable. Food allergy or whatever.

I will leave out my irritation about the use of the word instinct. :dough:

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