Someone on the radio raised an interesting point along this line. What happens when pedophilia, like homosexuality, becomes regarded as a congenital physical condition of the brain? Will there be pedophile rights, pedophile marriages, and whoever is opposed will be labled pedophiliphobic?
That is not an interesting point. A desire or whim doesn’t justify an act.
On a side note, homosexuality isn’t immoral among consenting adults (like any relationship) - and while I agree no group should have special rights - it sounds like whoever made that comment was using flawed logic to justify their own homophobic views. Equating homosexuality with pedophilia… Come on now.
How do you know that what you are describing is a cause in itself, or the effect of another cause?
Someone on the radio raised an interesting point along this line. What happens when pedophilia, like homosexuality, becomes regarded as a congenital physical condition of the brain? Will there be pedophile rights, pedophile marriages, and whoever is opposed will be labled pedophiliphobic?
It wouldn’t matter to anyone if it was proven to be unchosen. They would just be sent to a differenent kind or prison. Just because a condition is unchosen, that does not mean that the unchosen attribute needs to be tolerated. I don’t tolerate certain animals despite their lack of choice in their ways.
I could easily see pedophilia as a neurological problem of sorts, and maybe things coudl be done to repress it. That doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be jailed for their crimes.
How do you know that what you are describing is a cause in itself, or the effect of another cause?
Someone on the radio raised an interesting point along this line. What happens when pedophilia, like homosexuality, becomes regarded as a congenital physical condition of the brain? Will there be pedophile rights, pedophile marriages, and whoever is opposed will be labled pedophiliphobic?
With regards to pedophiles, I honestly think that many pedophiles cannot help themselves. This does not meant they should have legal or social permission to molest children. What it means is they need to be removed from society and subjected to compulsory treatment(if that is possible).
What is remarkable is that the brain, or shall I say certain peoples brains(the brains of many schizophrenics) can create a multiplicity of agents, some of which the person is only partially aware of. There are schizophrenics who speak of some sort of phantom agent that takes over their decision making process and compels them to do things.
Yeah, the brain is a complex system with levels of processing, which can fragment if the processing screws up.
Indeed, it is a mystery for what is responsible for consciousness/self-awareness. I’m thinking of science as well, but that still doesn’t indicate what the abstract points about the mind, including defining what a mind is. See post #9.
You sound like a behaviorist in your example. Behaviorism is fraught with problems. What you’re talking about is reinforcement, that is, there must be a positive stimulus (or negative stimulus) to cause behavior, not much different than causing a ball to roll by pushing it. You’re right that hunger is part of the process that leads you to eat. But is that all there is? Hunger causes eating, and that’s it? The explanation is incomplete. There has to be an account for mental states, the in-between stage between hunger and eating. Sure, you can’t just think “whatever” you please, but that isn’t to say actions can only be one way. As a system that processes information, the brain needs mental states, which may very well include volition choosing among a massive range of options. The words you’re reading don’t have an innate meaning that is automatically translated into action. All the symbols, you interpret those, and that’s more or less what volition is: interpretation of the world. Many options are possible, depending upon your mental state and your knowledge.
That is not an interesting point. A desire or whim doesn’t justify an act.
On a side note, homosexuality isn’t immoral among consenting adults (like any relationship) - and while I agree no group should have special rights
It’s already too late. This society has firmly adopted the genetic/chemical driven model of “unchosen” behavior, so it is only a matter of time before physical brain characteristics are identified and rights are established.
it sounds like whoever made that comment was using flawed logic to justify their own homophobic views.
You have just answered this question with a “yes”.
…and whoever is opposed will be labelled pedophiliphobic?
It wouldn’t matter to anyone if it was proven to be unchosen. They would just be sent to a differenent kind or prison. Just because a condition is unchosen, that does not mean that the unchosen attribute needs to be tolerated. I don’t tolerate certain animals despite their lack of choice in their ways.
I could easily see pedophilia as a neurological problem of sorts,
Then they deserve political rights from the government and chemical treatment from the medical establishment, because this is the amoral model which has been adopted by our society..
It’s already too late. This society has firmly adopted the genetic/chemical driven model of “unchosen” behavior, so it is only a matter of time before physical brain characteristics are identified and rights are established.
Science already accepts that there are unchosen desires - that doesn’t mean acting on them should be tolerated. Desires and whims shouldn’t guide choices.
You have just answered this question with a “yes”.
You’re equating homosexuality and pedophilia again - they are not the same. Not even remotely close to being the same. Acting on one violates rights, the other doesn’t.
Then they deserve political rights from the government and chemical treatment from the medical establishment, because this is the amoral model which has been adopted by our society..
A model that implies that someone “deserves” things is by definition not amoral.
Then they deserve political rights from the government and chemical treatment from the medical establishment, because this is the amoral model which has been adopted by our society..
Well if it is possible the criminally insane could be made to work towards paying for their own treatments. In its own weird way this could end up being part of their treatment.
I do think that prisoners who have commited violent crimes should attempt to pay for their own livelyhood.
No, they’re not. You admitted so yourself, when you used the word “deserve”. Amoral people don’t use the word “deserve”.
The use of the word “deserve” in that context was a facetious one, for the government grants political rights irrespective of morality. And this is their template:
The use of the word “deserve” in that context was a facetious one, for the government grants political rights irrespective of morality. And this is their template:
Declare a choiceless congenital condition.
2.Grant it political rights.
3.Treat it with chemicals.
What are you basing this off of? I doubt anyone in the government does this.
Whoa, I didn’t know Brave New World came true yet. Where’d you find soma, and where can I get some?
This is barely on topic, and I have no idea what chemicals has to do with volition here, unless you are attempting to claim some sort of substance dualism where the mind is wholly nonphysical and essentially mystical.
I have no idea what chemicals has to do with volition here
Chemicals are the answer when the reality of the existence of volition is denied.
unless you are attempting to claim some sort of substance dualism where the mind is wholly nonphysical and essentially mystical.
I’m claiming that the physical processes observed in the brain are symptoms, and not causes.
If you claim that the mind is wholly physical, then then there is no such thing as free will, and the answer to every problem known to man lies in finding just the right chemicals to ingest.
What are you basing this off of? I doubt anyone in the government does this.
Not necessarily directly, but government does promote faith in the narcoculture. Millions of people are prescribed psychotropic drugs to manage their “moods”. And millions of parents drug their “ADHD” kids. In my opinion, this is only treating symptoms, not causes.
Once the existence of free moral choice to either do good or evil is denied, something else has to rise to compensate for that denial of reality. In the case of the US, it’s the narcoculture which has become that compensation for people’s failure to govern their own behavior.
If you claim that the mind is wholly physical, then then there is no such thing as free will, and the answer to every problem known to man lies in finding just the right chemicals to ingest.
The most basic processes in the brain take place at the atomic level and are best described by quantum physics which is a non deterministic theory. We have a head full of q-bits.
The most basic processes in the brain take place at the atomic level and are best described by quantum physics which is a non deterministic theory. We have a head full of q-bits.
Not necessarily directly, but government does promote faith in the narcoculture. Millions of people are prescribed psychotropic drugs to manage their “moods”. And millions of parents drug their “ADHD” kids. In my opinion, this is only treating symptoms, not causes.
Once the existence of free moral choice to either do good or evil is denied, something else has to rise to compensate for that denial of reality. In the case of the US, it’s the narcoculture which has become that compensation for people’s failure to govern their own behavior.
Oh that.
Well I don’t think it is a matter of philosophy. Drug companies want to sell drugs and will enlist whoever they can to help them do that. It has nothing to do with determinism.