Americans are "narrow-minded"

Psychology and Self Improvement
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I don’t live in America and I’ve met only a handful of Americans over my life, but my impression is highly favorable (but this is based on meeting American travelers and Americans on the internet, a biased sample). 

 

Yet, I so frequently run into people who tell me Americans are “narrow-minded”, “close minded”, “clueless” etc. As far as getting the person to explain to me what they mean, an explanation will usually consist of American’s not being able to tell you something like what the capital of Turkey, where France is, that they are stupid, only concerned with themselves and their own country. 

 

I don’t get this and I don’t like it at all. In my own country and every other country I’ve traveled to there are loads of uneducated, bigoted and clueless people. I hate that it’s said with this air of superiority and that they are generalizing it to most Americans… as if our country and it’s people are somehow better.

 

So why is it that Americans are always singled out? Why is it so fashionable to attack them? Is there some element of truth to these attacks?

 

Has anyone else experienced this attitude?

 

 

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Quote from above: “So why is it that Americans are always singled out? Why is it so fashionable to attack them? Is there some element of truth to these attacks?”

 

My reply does not specifically address “narrow-mindedness,” but I have experienced some of the other attitude you describe above that may help to explain what foreigners think, or perhaps more precisely “feel” about Americans. That feeling strikes me as being primarily envy; but also a misdiagnosis of the American sense of life.

 

In 1971, I was visiting the city of Valparaiso, Chile. One evening while walking about, I met three college students: two guys and a girl. They immediately identified me as American (probably from my mode of dress) and asked if I would be interested in having a drink and a conversation. We spent the next hour at a quiet bar and I answered many questions they had about America.

 

The one question that I remember quite well is: “Why does America always have to be number one at everything?” During the discussion that followed this question, it became obvious to me that these students considered Americans to be generally arrogant, self-centered and uncaring about others (just to name a few of their criticisms). They believed Americans were always in competition with each other and with the rest of the world.

 

In general, my response amounted to a description of the average American as being an individualist concerned almost entirely with creating a good life for himself and his loved ones, and that he was mostly unaware of competition in his quest to succeed in his goal. I also pressed upon the idea that individual freedom was greater in America than in many other countries; which allowed an American to actually realize a good life created by his own efforts.

 

We parted friends at the end of our conversation and I believe I partly convinced them that there was such a thing as a good American. However, that memory, and memories of my many visits to other countries around the world still cause me to conclude that the primary emotion we Americans instill in foreigners is envy.

 

Regards… Aqualyst

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… people who tell me Americans are “narrow-minded”, “close minded”, “clueless”

There’s an element of truth to this. When I first came to the U.S., I noticed that world news was a smaller proportion of the T.V. diet. Everywhere in the world, most TV news is preoccupied by local politics. Still, when something happens in the U.S. it has a higher chance of being reported abroad than a similar event has of being reported in the U.S. The bottom line is that its wealth coupled with its size makes the U.S. is the most important country in the world.

Yes, there are a lot of ignorant, clueless people all over the world. However, even among the educated classes, it is far more likely that a foreigner follows a U.S. election than that a U.S. person follows a foreign election. Add in Hollywood and U.S. brands like MacDonald’s or Gillette, and you have a whole other dimension of influence and awareness flowing mostly in one direction.

In addition, foreign politicians often like to blame the U.S. for their problems and many people buy it. When I was growing up abroad, many average, educated people used to say that the west was happy to keep the third-world down. And, the U.S. is the symbol of the west. They definitely blamed their own politicians for most local problems, but the west was always a part of the problem. In addition, most people would say “Americans are nice, but their government messes with everybody”.

 

I think knowing a bit more about the world is important to U.S. citizens who consider themselves educated and intellectual. Nevertheless, it is natural that there’s a higher awareness of the U.S. among foreigners than vice versa.

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This is basic tribalism. Demonization of the other is a theme that resonates throughout history. Even apparently intelligent people fall victim to this unintelligent mode of thinking. You will see evidence of this in all cultures throughout the whole world and through all time. When you define the other as less worthy, you feel much less guilt when abusing their rights. An evolutionary advantage is gained and that is why you will continue to see this behavior well into the future. It is a mode of thinking that justifies the initiation of force and is hence evil.

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I, a minarchist in Canada, have noted that there is an undercurrent of the same sentiments in people who are primarily simply envious of the U.S.'s accomplishments.  Others are, simply put, socialist and diametrically opposed to what the U.S. is supposed to stand for (or what it did prior to Obama, or Roosevelt, or at the time of the founding).  These mealy mouthed bleeding heart tyrants next door like to think of themselves as “global” and interested in the “welfare” of the world… no doubt an individualist of the U.S. primarily concerned with his own life is “clueless” according to people of this ilk. 

 

Basically envy, and orientation away from individualism are the likely causes throughout the world for this attitude.  In free countries the attitude will mostly be from envy, in leftist countries a large component will come from an orientation away from individualism.

 

 

Right now Hong Kong, Singapore, Australia, New Zealand, and Switzerland are ranked as top 5 “free” on the 2013 Index of Economic Freedom by the heritage foundation.

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I think most Americans would agree, but not as a single group.  These are the common expressions of anyone who maintains an us vs them mentality, where us are invariably more intelligent, capable, worldly, i.e., better than them.  Americans, as aliens, are perceived similarly to the way Americans perceive aliens, e.g., clueless, backwards and generally not to be taken seriously except as a potential threat.

 

Ones friends are uniquely virtuous, by virtue of being one of us.

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The name calling itself is just a symptom of anti-Americanism. It has absolutely no basis in reality. People who engage in it have no interest in forming an accurate picture of Americans. As for anti-Americanism, it has more than one source (various ideologies, including some already mentioned in hte thread), but the main one, by far, is nationalism.

The United States is evil simply by virtue of being involved in matters nationalists consider the exclusive purview of members of their own nation. Any foreign meddling, be it positive or negative, is evil by virtue of being foreign.

The United States is of course the world’s superpower, and it does indeed use its power to do a lot of “meddling”. Most of it, positive. The United States is responsible for a lot of freedom and happiness around the world. But that’s entirely irrelevant to a nationalist. Sure, the US promotes economic freedom in Russia. But, to a Russian nationalist, that’s wrong. It’s wrong even if that Russian nationalist sees the value of economic freedom, and would embrace the suggestion if it came from a Russian politician. That’s just what nationalism is.

There are of course many, many people around the world, usually people who don’t buy into the various collectivist ideologies, who admire the US. It doesn’t even have to be people who are outspoken individualists. In fact there are entire countries where the majority of people view Americans very favorably.

I think most Americans would agree.

“to agree” is a transitive verb. No point in using it without an object. Just in case you don’t know what an object is, it’s sharing with the class WHAT it is you think Americans agree with.

the way Americans perceive aliens, e.g., clueless, backwards and generally not to be taken seriously except as a potential threat.

Is that really how Americans view foreigners? Or are you just saying that because it sounds like something that would confirm your theories?

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“to agree” is a transitive verb. No point in using it without an object. Just in case you don’t know what an object is, it’s sharing with the class WHAT it is you think Americans agree with.

The object I was refering to was the kind of comments presented by the OP.  Most Americans also desparage members of groups they disagree with as being “narrow-minded”, “close minded”, or “clueless”.  Thank you for allowing me to clarify this for the rest of the class.

 

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Is that really how Americans view foreigners? Or are you just saying that because it sounds like something that would confirm your theories?

That is typically how the members of one group (Americans included) view the opposition.  What you address as nationalism is also true of how American political parties view each, even down to how neighbors view each other’s behavior.

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The object I was refering to was the kind of comments presented by the OP.  Most Americans also desparage members of groups they disagree with as being “narrow-minded”, “close minded”, or “clueless”.  Thank you for allowing me to clarify this for the rest of the class.

 

That is typically how the members of one group (Americans included) view the opposition.  What you address as nationalism is also true of how American political parties view each, even down to how neighbors view each other’s behavior.

 

insofar as you are correct, what you identify at play are the tribal, socialistic, affinities of certain people rather than the individualistic sense of life of other people… most of the latter of which likely reside in the U.S. 

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insofar as you are correct, what you identify at play are the tribal, socialistic, affinities of certain people rather than the individualistic sense of life of other people… most of the latter of which likely reside in the U.S. 

Call it what you will, but ultimately all groups are abstractions.  When people refer to Americans, they refer to the body politic, which hardly accounts for any real knowledge of the individuals themselves who make up that particular group.  There will remain subsets of Americans, Mexicans and Canadians who have more in common with each other than the political leadership which represents them.  The best one can say of Americans in terms of groups, is that America has more of them.  This may account for Americans having a greater “individualistic sense of life of other people”, but I believe you are being generous with your opinion, even for a Canadian :stuck_out_tongue:

 

LoBagola’s highly favorable, if somewhat limited sample of Americans, was formed primarily by meeting American travelers and Americans on the internet (another form of travel); specifically, Americans abroad or in cyberspace who are further removed from the body politic that represents them.  My question to him is, does he have a similarly favorable view of American politics, as the representation of those travelers he’s met personally, or is he simply connecting their act of travel, i.e., of showing interest in something beyond ones borders, as being open minded and knowledgeable??

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Is that really how Americans view foreigners? Or are you just saying that because it sounds like something that would confirm your theories?

Not any more than some Americans make sweeping generalizations about other countries. People have assumptions about Americans, but it doesn’t exactly translate to anti-Americanism. Some Americans in fact make assumptions, or may not bother to learn about a language when going to another country. There are also some aspects of American culture that are rather odd compared to other countries.

Sometimes it’s rather bizarre to imagine that there are reasons to say Americans are narrow-minded, but it’s rather hard to actually get a non-American perspective. Likewise for people from other countries. There is no malicious ideology necessary. Sure, vocal politicians of other countries express anti-Americanism, but it doesn’t translate to all negative opinions being “anti-American”. The perspective of Europeans about Americans might be “gun owners that like to wear cowboy hats and go hunting every week” for instance, while American perspective about Spaniards might be “classical guitar lovers who eat paella every day”. Just silly stereotypes that are mostly unfair, but it’s not anything like “anti-whatever” sentiments.

 

Example of what I’m thinking about:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=178xvHzPYgY

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Not any more than some Americans make sweeping generalizations about other countries. People have assumptions about Americans, but it doesn’t exactly translate to anti-Americanism. Some Americans in fact make assumptions, or may not bother to learn about a language when going to another country. There are also some aspects of American culture that are rather odd compared to other countries.

Sometimes it’s rather bizarre to imagine that there are reasons to say Americans are narrow-minded, but it’s rather hard to actually get a non-American perspective. Likewise for people from other countries. There is no malicious ideology necessary. Sure, vocal politicians of other countries express anti-Americanism, but it doesn’t translate to all negative opinions being “anti-American”. The perspective of Europeans about Americans might be “gun owners that like to wear cowboy hats and go hunting every week” for instance, while American perspective about Spaniards might be “classical guitar lovers who eat paella every day”. Just silly stereotypes that are mostly unfair, but it’s not anything like “anti-whatever” sentiments.

 

Example of what I’m thinking about:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=178xvHzPYgY

I don’t think that is what is being discussed in this thread. I’m surprised that during your time on the internet, you’ve not come across the extremely common phenomenon of foreigners generalizing Americans as ignorant, dumbed-down, warmongers, etc. 

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I don’t think that is what is being discussed in this thread. I’m surprised that during your time on the internet, you’ve not come across the extremely common phenomenon of foreigners generalizing Americans as ignorant, dumbed-down, warmongers, etc. 

I have. Some Americans do it too towards other countries in equally unfair ways. My point was mainly that it’s not necessarily “anti-Americanism”. Sometimes it’s just a stupid stereotype and nothing more nefarious. I see it more along the lines of the Portlandia sketch where some Americans make themselves look ironically ignorant.

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There is an epistemological issue, an extension of the so-called “crow epistemology” that can only keep track of so many things at once.  That is that there are 50 American states, many of which are bigger than entire countries in Europe.  Being a well informed American can preclude having time or memory capacity to also give a damn about Europe (or New Zealand, or wherever).

 

Another issue is that when there is a language barrier is seems to be not symmetrical.  English has spread all over the world for a number of commercial and cultural reasons, so persons that are not American are more likely to have enough command of English as a second language to follow events in America than an American would be to pick up enough German, or French or Arabic to follow events there in a first-handed way.

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"LoBagola’s highly favorable, if somewhat limited sample of Americans, was formed primarily by meeting American travelers and Americans on the internet (another form of travel); specifically, Americans abroad or in cyberspace who are further removed from the body politic that represents them.  My question to him is, does he have a similarly favorable view of American politics, as the representation of those travelers he’s met personally, or is he simply connecting their act of travel, i.e., of showing interest in something beyond ones borders, as being open minded and knowledgeable??"

 

My view is favourable not because I’ve drawn some conclusion on the general population but because many of the Americans I met are “outlier” types who I have trouble finding anywhere else. E.g. a self-taught engineer designing 3D printers in China, self-taught freelance programmer who’s well read on the most esoteric topics, sustainability engineer who’s fluent in Mandarin and many many more (that’s only on a backpacking trip to China). Then tons more elsewhere while traveling. My view is favourable because while there may be “narrow-minded” or “ignorant” (whatever that means - I don’t know) people in America it seems to me like there are a lot more extremely intelligent and non-conventional types too. I’ve met many unusually intelligent people here too but they all seem to fit some instituional mold. E.g. intelligent economics student - knows everything he’s been taught at university but hasn’t read that much in his own time or really thought extensively about connecting his knowledge to other fields or challenging pre-existing ideas. Whereas I’ve met an economics grad from America who taught himself a bunch of programming languages, read lots of books on logic, philosophy and enviromental sustainibility. So one’s knowledge is contained in a vacuum, the other seems to have thought much wider and done a lot more on his own.

 

This could just be chance. I don’t know. I’m a student - I meet a lot of very smart people right here in my country and yet it just seems like thinking beyond what your taught and self-teaching is much more common in America.

 

This is what I meant by my favourable view.

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I am neither proud nor embarrassed to be an American. I am lucky to be an American. I am proud to be a capitalist, rationalist, and an individualist. Being an American allows me to exercise my preferences, (well, most of them), without (much) interference from the American government or societal pressures. As for what people of other countries believe about Americans, who cares?

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This is what I meant by my favourable view.

Thank you very much for your thorough response to my query, and for introducing me to the term outlier.

 

Yes, I think America provides a good, if not exclusive, environment for producing outlier types.  A popular expression here is, thinking out of the box; the box being conventional practice and procedures.  To the degree that Americans have greater freedoms to enjoy (and abuse), this would account for a larger number of American outliers than countries where straying from conventional practices and procedures is discouraged.

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Americans, as aliens, are perceived similarly to the way Americans perceive aliens, e.g., clueless, backwards and generally not to be taken seriously except as a potential threat.

Is that really how Americans view foreigners?

Not any more than some Americans make sweeping generalizations about other countries.

Saying “Americans” means one is referring to the norm, rather than the exceptions. Saying “some Americans” means the exact opposite.

By purposefully switching the subject from “Americans” to “some Americans”, you might as well have posted about what you had for breakfast. Your reply has no logical connection to my question.

And what’s the difference between a sweeping generalization and a regular generalization?

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The object I was refering to was the kind of comments presented by the OP.

Americans would agree that Americans are narrow minded?

That is typically how the members of one group (Americans included) view the opposition.

Agreed, groups view their opposition unfavorably. So do individuals. Now all you need to prove is that foreign nationals are “the opposition”, and you have a solid argument. But, if you don’t do that (and you won’t, becuase it’s not true), you have no argument whatsoever.

Call it what you will, but ultimately all groups are abstractions.

Not true. It sounds like you don’t know what abstractions are.

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By purposefully switching the subject from “Americans” to “some Americans”, you might as well have posted about what you had for breakfast. Your reply has no logical connection to my question.

And what’s the difference between a sweeping generalization and a regular generalization?

I didn’t swap the subject. I’m saying some Americans say stupid things, and so do some non-Americans. Well, if you’re talking about DA, I think DA should have said “some”. I forget the word "some’ more often than I’d like, personally.

 

A sweeping generalization is one usually done with induction by enumeration, which is not good. Thus, it’s another way to say stereotype. Why might some people develop particular stereotypes about Americans? Grames gives good possibilities.