Are Definitions tautologies?

If it’s wrong to use the word contingent then it’s also wrong to use the word tautology, which leads me back to my original answer. 

 

You’re original answer was, No, definitions cannot be regarded as tautologies. That is wrong. They can be regarded as tautologies for the same reason that any true proposition can be regarded as a tautology.

 

 

If you want to talk about tautologies, you have to accept the definition. You can’t refuse to use the word contingent.

 

I don’t think that’s the definition of a tautology. Following the rule of fundamentality, it seems like a better definition of tautology would be: A propositions whose predicate is contained in the subject. That is more fundamental because the fact that a tautology is not contingent on any knowledge is a derivative characteristic of the one I used as a differentia above. But whatever, if you think I’m being too nit picky with terminology that’s your judgement to make. So long as my post made people clarify ‘contingent’ vs ‘contextual’ than I’ve achieved my goal in bringing up the distinction.

I don’t think that’s the definition of a tautology. 

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect speakers of a language to conform to the conventions that link words in that language to specific concepts.

 

In this case, that convention states that the word tautology should be used to refer to the following concepts:

 

tau·tol·o·gy

/tôˈtäləjē/

noun

noun: tautology

the saying of the same thing twice in different words, generally considered to be a fault of style (e.g., they arrived one after the other in succession ).synonyms: pleonasm, repetition, reiteration, redundancy, superfluity, duplication “avoid such tautology as “let’s all work together, everyone, as a team” by saying simply “let’s work together””

a phrase or expression in which the same thing is said twice in different words.

plural noun: tautologies

Logic

a statement that is true by necessity or by virtue of its logical form.

 

This last one is the relevant one. There’s no mistaking what that means. It doesn’t mean definitions. Like it or not, agree with it or not, it means that thing the people who created propositional logic said it means.

 

Are you planning on redefining every single word in the English language created by people you disagree with?

 

 

 

The three statements given here are all direct applications of the principle of non-contradiction, which is itself the negative of the Law of Identity (“A is not non-A”)

 

The Law of Identity “A is A” is a tautology.  It counts as knowledge because it is the fundamental principle of logic, and logic is a method of thinking that is first learned and then known.  Skills count as knowledge.

I agree with you that the Law of Identity is knowledge. 

 

However, if someone chooses not to address the issue, but rather just create a theoretical framework based on the Law of Identity, there is nothing wrong with that. Propositional logic is not about knowledge, it’s a theoretical framework built on the Law of Identity, in which propositions are considered either tautologies or contradictions, unless they are contingent on something other than the Law of Identity. 

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect speakers of a language to conform to the conventions that link words in that language to specific concepts.

 

In this case, that convention states that the word tautology should be used to refer to the following concepts:

 

This last one is the relevant one. There’s no mistaking what that means. It doesn’t mean definitions. Like it or not, agree with it or not, it means that thing the people who created propositional logic said it means.

 

Are you planning on redefining every single word in the English language created by people you disagree with?

 

 

What!?? People on this board are incredibly frustrating today. I offered a different definition of a term, which I came to by trying to apply Rand’s theory of definitions, during a technical philosophy discussion on the nature of definitions. Does that imply that I intend to redefine every single word in the English language? You don’t like my definition, fine. Offer some other definition and a reason you think it’s valid.

 

None of the definitions you copy and pasted even use the word ‘contingent’ anyway.

 

If it’s wrong to use the word contingent then it’s also wrong to use the word tautology, which leads me back to my original answer. 

 

If you want to talk about tautologies, you have to accept the definition. You can’t refuse to use the word contingent.

 

:blink:

Well, I think it’s merely a question of what we need to differentiate the units against. A man made fact is still a fact so if gay marriage becomes legal then it becomes necessary to adjust our differentia to properly differentiate the units. It’s all a question of what the context demands we do to keep the units clearly differentiated.

 

I see what you are saying. Some sort of actual change would have to happen (change in regulation..etc.) to invalidate “Bachelors are men who have no wife”.

 

While it’s reasonable to imagine such a change in man-made regulation (as opposed to ice sinking in water), imagining by itself still isn’t enough to invalidate “Bachelors are men who have no wife”, actual regulation change have to take place.

 

And if actual change happens, the invalidation of that definition can then be appropriately said to have happened on contextual ground.

 

 

But I wouldn’t say concepts are formed for the purpose of attempting to provide the clearest contrast between existents. The purpose of forming a concept is to achieve a unit (universal) perspective on a set of existents. It’s the purpose of a definition to keep the concepts clearly organized in your head- the genus tells you the wider concept to which the defined concept belongs and differentia distinguishes precisely which units of the genus the defined concept is referring to.

 

Point taken. Concept’s main function is to achieve unit perspective on a set of existent so that more efficient and effective cognitive activities can be achieved. Definitions are what helps to clearly keep the boundary between concepts.

 

 

The concept ‘bachelor’ isn’t merely subjectively important. There are real, objective reasons for having such a concept. Bachelors tend to party it up, have awesome pads, are available for marriage, etc. It is incredibly useful to have the concept regardless of people’s opinions on marriage. With respect to the fundamentality of the essential characteristic (unmarried) vs. intent, I think you have cause and effect reversed. The reason people intend to differentiate between married and unmarried men is because being unmarried is an essential characteristic- it gives rise to other characteristics and actions which make the concept useful in the first place.

 

Here’s a better explanation of what I’m trying to say, from ITOE (http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/rands_razor.html):

 

It is incredibly useful to have the concept. I was thinking along the line that if the vast majority of people didn’t really care about the quality of been unmarried, they would just call such a man “unmarried man” instead of bothering to make up a whole new term.

 

As for why people would care, I see what you mean about people caring/valuing the quality of been unmarried objectively. When I said people valued the quality of been unmarried subjectively, I completely forgot about that whole “Subjective vs Objective vs Intrinsic” thing. People don’t value been “unmarried” subjectively just because. They value been “unmarried” at the very least due to the fact that such man is available for marriage. Such valuation based on the availability for marriage or any other facet of reality (partying/pads..etc.) would place the concern on Objective ground instead of Subjective.

 

Given that case, it does make sense then that Rule of Fundementality also applies to the definition of “Bachelor”. Even if in a world where the only major difference between bachelors and married men is that bachelors are available for marriage (no difference in partying/pads..etc.), that single characteristic, “available for marriage”, is dependent/linked back to the essential characteristic of been “unmarried”. 

 

Since it’s so obvious and simple the application of RoF in the case of “bachelor” when compared to the example of using RoF to identify the essential characteristic of human being in that lexicon excerpt, I guess I missed it. But I can see now how the same principle applies.

I

 

This last one is the relevant one. There’s no mistaking what that means. It doesn’t mean definitions. Like it or not, agree with it or not, it means that thing the people who created propositional logic said it means.

 

Are you planning on redefining every single word in the English language created by people you disagree with?

 

Just the ones that are wrong, and which I have the time for.  I make time for words and ideas that touch on essential philosophical issues such as “truth”.

 

In this definition of tautology “a statement that is true by necessity or by virtue of its logical form” what does it mean to be “true”?  I ask this because Objectivism has a theory of what truth means which is the correspondence principle, which is relating a concept or proposition back to a mind-independent reality.   Tautologies are considered as stand-alone atoms of thought.  The problem I see is that a proposition considered by itself merely relates words to words not words to reality, so it cannot claim truth but only methodological correctness.

 

The necessity referenced in the statement “that is true by necessity or by virtue of its logical form” is logical necessity.  The proper term for propositions arranged in proper technically correct logical forms is “valid”  not true.  A tautology can be relied upon to always be correct, but if it is composed of words that are symbols of concepts then those concepts are subject to further validation before the tautology can be accepted as true.

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I don’t think it’s unreasonable to expect speakers of a language to conform to the conventions that link words in that language to specific concepts.

The alternative would just be dirty, rotten selfishness!