Economic Cycles (and Austrian Economics in general)

For the determination of the price level, it is the total supply of means of exchange that is relevant, not just the supply of gold. The M in MV = PQ should include gold as well as substitutes, not just gold.

Ok, so where do you draw the line in defining money? Is commercial paper money? Are repurchase agreements money? Are money market mutual fund investments money? I have a post in the Fractional Reserve Banking thread under the Ethics forum that defines the various measures of money and monetary aggregates (M0 through M3), both in today’s fiat environment, and in a future free market economy.

Money is gold and any other commodity accepted at a depository institution. The notes that a depository institution creates are NOT money, they are substitutes for monies deposited.

How would you view an increase in gold mined in an unmanipulated capitalist economy? It is clear that it would constitute an increase in loanable funds, but would that be an increase in wealth produced or just an increase in the money supply? Would it lead to an undesirable boom-bust sequence, or would it be “kosher with Austrians” (so to speak :lol: i.e., would they consider it “cycle-neutral”)?

It would be an increase in produced wealth, and an increase in the (current) money supply. It would not lead to an undesirable boom-bust sequence, because it is an increase in actual productive wealth, as opposed to an increase in paper bills.

The reason gold is a value is two-fold in a free society. One is that it serves as a medium of exchange; the second is that it can be used for other purposes like jewelry, decorating, etc.

Assume that gold is found and mined in the free society. This decreases the value of each gold unit in terms of other goods; in other words, the valuation given to gold because of its utility as a medium of exchange falls. However, the decrease in the value of a gold unit will mean that one can purchase a unit of gold for less “other goods”. Therefore, demand for gold based on its “other purpose” value will rise. In so much as this happens, the utility of gold as a facilitator of exchange will diminish and its utility as jewelry will increase. It is possible that, given enough new production, people would simply stop using gold as a medium of exchange (because it is too abundant, i.e. not scarce enough), and switch to some other commodity (say) silver.

The increased production of a gold mine is simply that: increased production. Thus it adds to the pool of wealth, and is not the same as printing letters on a piece of paper. Producing gold and exchanging it for other goods and services is exchanging something for something, not nothing for something (fiat systems).

Ok, so where do you draw the line in defining money?

I define money as the means of exchange. Thus, in its strictest sense, money means all those assets that are widely accepted as forms of payment and are held exclusively to facilitate transactions. In a gold-based free economy, this inclues:

  • gold coins
  • non-gold coins convertible into gold at a fixed rate
  • gold certificates
  • bills
  • checking accounts
  • traveler’s checks
  • debit cards
  • PayPal balances

and the like. In a broader sense of the term, you could include all dollar-denominated assets that are liquid enough to be easily convertible into gold at a fixed rate, such as:

  • AAA-rated bonds
  • savings accounts
  • certificates of deposit

Sometimes, people use the term even more broadly, and refer to their riskier bonds and even their stock holdings as their “money.” At the end of the scale, all material wealth is sometimes referred to as “money” (e.g. in the phrase “making money” used to describe the creation of wealth); this is similar to how a 90-year old woman sometimes ends up being referred to as a “girl.”

Money is gold and any other commodity accepted at a depository institution. The notes that a depository institution creates are NOT money, they are substitutes for monies deposited.

That is what von Mises says–and I disagree. If the dollar bills issued by banks are accepted just as readily as a form of payment as gold coins are, then the two can be used interchangeably for transactional purposes and there is no essential difference between them. Defining money by its “goldness” is an example of definition by non-essentials; it would be like insisting that “transportation” means only walking (and swimming, etc.) and that any technology created by walkers to make their lives easier, be it a buggy or an automobile or an airplane, is NOT transportation but a “transportation substitute.”

If you want to refer to gold specifically, we already have a concept for that: “gold.” (I am not sure what you mean by “any other commodity accepted at a depository institution,” but if it is the possibility of other precious metals serving as money you want to indicate, then one can use the phrase “the money metal” instead of “gold.”)

It would be an increase in produced wealth, and an increase in the (current) money supply. It would not lead to an undesirable boom-bust sequence, because it is an increase in actual productive wealth

Good, we agree so far. Do you also agree with my statement that it would be an increase in loanable funds ? If so, do you think it would lower the interest rate?

The increased production of a gold mine is simply that: increased production. Thus it adds to the pool of wealth, and is not the same as printing letters on a piece of paper.

Which brings us to the next question I wanted to ask: If a bank in a fully capitalist, gold-based economy decided to lower its reserve rate, i.e. “print more letters on pieces of paper,” would that bring about the boom-bust sequence? In other words, do you think the undesirable effects can arise in a free market? (We are operating under the assumption that all the bank’s depositors have been fully aware of the possibility of this from day 1 and still were happy to entrust their money with the bank–so there is no question of any fraud being involved.)

I define money as the means of exchange…

In your view, is there a difference between an ounce of actual gold, and a note printed by a bank that says “Redeemable for 1 ounce of gold”? If both of the above consitute “money”, then you have muddied the definition of money to include everything under the sun by defining it as ‘means of exchange’.

J.P Morgan said: “Only gold is money; all the rest is paper.” A paper note redeemable for gold is, by definition, a paper note redeemable for gold, and is therefore NOT “as good as gold”, because it is subject to default risk by the issuing bank. Therefore, it is NOT the same thing as the underlying value, or money. The banknote is worth a certain amount of money, in the same way a mortgage note is worth $300,000 and a car note is worth $25,000. Notes are, by definition, convertible into money, but they are NOT money.

When I take my gold note to the butcher and buy meat, I give him my Bank A banknote. He takes that to Bank B, where he deposits it. Bank B contacts Bank A, and the corresponding amount of gold reserves are transferred from the vaults of Bank A to the vaults of Bank B. The underlying value that made possible the transaction is gold, it was not the banknote. The banknote helped in so much as it substituted for gold. Certainly the butcher wouldn’t take a piece of paper that I scribbled “Redeemable for 1 ounce of gold” on with a crayon just before I walked in the door. The butcher would prefer to be paid in gold, because there is less risk involved, but he is happy to sell his meat in exchange for a reputable banknote backed by gold.

Do you also agree with my statement that it would be an increase in loanable funds ? If so, do you think it would lower the interest rate?

It would be an increase in loanable funds of gold. It would lower the interest rate of gold. It would decrease the utility of gold qua medium of exchange and increase the utility of gold qua jewelry. In a free economy, there is not one central manipulated interest rate (i.e. Fed Funds rate), which all other rates follow, so the question sort of contains a false premise.

Which brings us to the next question I wanted to ask: If a bank in a fully capitalist, gold-based economy decided to lower its reserve rate, i.e. “print more letters on pieces of paper,” would that bring about the boom-bust sequence? In other words, do you think the undesirable effects can arise in a free market?

That depends. A boom-bust sequence has to have widespread participation by many economic actors. So, the answer presupposes that there would only be one bank and one banknote in the entire economy. I don’t believe that monopolies occur in a free market; I believe that they only occur with the aid of government coercion.

In your view, is there a difference between an ounce of actual gold, and a note printed by a bank that says “Redeemable for 1 ounce of gold”? If both of the above consitute “money”, then you have muddied the definition of money to include everything under the sun by defining it as ‘means of exchange’.

Now don’t be silly. Everything under the sun is not a means of exchange, so defining money as such does not mean it includes everything under the sun.

There are, however, certain specific things that people do use from time to time as means of exchange. Items that are redeemable in gold, but are not gold themselves. Wouldn’t you agree that it is useful to have a concept to capture this characteristic of these items?

If not, how do you define money? What do you think is its essential characteristic?

It would be an increase in loanable funds of gold. It would lower the interest rate of gold. It would decrease the utility of gold qua medium of exchange and increase the utility of gold qua jewelry. In a free economy, there is not one central manipulated interest rate (i.e. Fed Funds rate), which all other rates follow, so the question sort of contains a false premise.

So am I correct to infer that you hold that, in a free economy, the interest rates of loans made in gold can be permanently and significantly lower than similar loans made and repaid, say, by check? But if gold can be borrowed at 4%, why would anyone borrow by check at 7%? People are not fools. If someone needed $100,000 in his checking account, he would borrow $100,000 in gold, put it into his trunk and deliver it into his bank to deposit it into his account. No one would insist on borrowing any significant sum by check if it cost him 7%, while borrowing in gold only cost 4%.

Of course there would be many different interest rates, but the differences would be caused by things like the creditworthiness of the borrower and the riskiness of the venture he is proposing. The means by which the funds are transferred from the borrower to the lender and vice versa should make no difference.

And why do you say that additional gold would “increase the utility of gold qua jewelry” ? If there is more gold, that makes it less precious, doesn’t it?

Anyway, the reason I asked the original question was because I do not believe that an increase in gold mining would necessarily lower the interest rate–any interest rate. In a free market, interest rates are determined by the supply of and demand for a certain type of capital : the kind of capital that is the opposite of venture capital–the more “conservative” forms of capital, i.e. loans and bonds, as opposed to stocks or the “lottery”-like funding of ventures. There is no direct connection between the supply of gold and the supply of and demand for such “conservative” capital. The newly-found gold becomes the property of the miners who found it, and it is up to them to decide what to do with it.

Let’s say, for example, that a miner has mined $1,000,000 worth of gold, and that he wants to spend it on a new home. The home he has in mind costs $1,750,000, so he takes the $1,000,000 of gold to the seller and borrows $750,000 from a bank. What has happened, then, is that the demand for loan capital has increased by $750,000, putting an upward pressure on interest rates, while the supply of loan capital … well, that depends on what the seller of the house does. If he decides to keep the $1,000,000 in his vault, the supply of capital remains unchanged. But that is the least likely scenario. He might want to invest the money “conservatively,” in which case supply of such capital will increase by $1,000,000–or he could decide to buy a house for $1,500,000, borrowing the $500,000 and thus again adding further to the demand for loans, and then the outcome further depends on what the seller of that house decides to do with the $1,000,000 in gold … and so on.

So what we really have is more money circulating in the economy. Some of the new money may be converted into jewels, so another effect is that we’ll have more gold jewelry in the economy. Thus, the new gold has increased the supply of: 1., money, and 2., jewels. But it has no definite effect on the supply of, nor the demand for, loan capital–and therefore, no definite effect on any interest rate. This is one of the major points where I disagree with the Austrians (and probably every other economist in existence today other than Richard Salsman): An increase in the money supply does not necessarily mean lower interest rates, nor vice versa.

The same is true for the gold that becomes available when a bank realizes that it can safely lower its reserve rate. It adds to the money supply, and to the supply of gold jewelry, but it has no direct connection to the rates charged on loans.

That depends. A boom-bust sequence has to have widespread participation by many economic actors. So, the answer presupposes that there would only be one bank and one banknote in the entire economy. I don’t believe that monopolies occur in a free market; I believe that they only occur with the aid of government coercion.

If most of the economy’s major banks decided to lower their reserve rates within a short timespan, though, would that cause a boom-bust?

It is also unclear to me what exactly is meant by the time preferences “reasserting” themselves. What actions by what market participants does that term refer to?

Time preferences are asserted in the first place by the process of individuals, first, looking at their existing investments (if any) and their incomes, and second, then deciding whether to add to, maintain, or draw down their investments and altering their spending habits to suit. To add means to direct the resources received as income towards investment, while to draw down means to take resources out of investment and add to final consumption instead.

The root criterion is people’s varying preferences to consume now versus consuming in the future. Everyone, to varying degrees, prefers to consume sooner rather than later, but we can be induced to consume later (ie induced to invest instead), by the promise of getting a return on the resources we could use for either purpose. The core component of interest rates is the numerical manifestation of that time preference, which exists even before consideration of risk. Thus different people have different core risk-free rates of return that must be on offer in order for them to invest.

On top of that comes a risk premium for the amount of risk associated with an investment being contemplated. Most people are risk averse, that the more risk there is in a given investment the higher the return that people will want from it as compensation for bearing that risk. Just as there are different degrees of time preference for different individuals so are there different degrees of risk aversiveness for different individuals.

Lastly, in addition to the two core elements there is a third important element. There must also be a premium to compensate for a decline in (or, more rarely, a discount for an increase in) - the purchasing power of money. In short, there must be an inflation premium. The more that people expect the purchasing power of money to decline by the future time they will spend that money at, the higher the premium they will require as compensation.

Those three combined - the risk-free rate, the risk premium, and the inflation premium - are the great bulk of what makes up interest rates on loans and expected ROE’s on stocks. The market rates of return, whether in the form of debt interest or equity profits, are the aggregate of all individuals acting to supply or demand capital based on their time preferences, degrees of risk aversiveness, and expectations of changes in purchasing power. The actual ROR goes down as capital supplied goes up (ceteris paribus, of course), because that capital is funding more competition both for custmers and suppliers. The required ROR goes up as capital goes up because there is less need felt to invest and because as consumption goes down the per-unit value attached to what consumption is retained goes up. If the actual RORs are above the required RORs, people will invest more until the actual RORs come down and the required RORs go up to match. Likewise, if actual RORs are below the required RORs, people will withhold or withdraw investments until the actual returns rise and required returns fall to match.

A financial institution is a medium by which this aggregation process can take place more efficiently than would occur without it. However - and here is an important point - the actions of a financial institution cannot alter the two fundamental determinants, though it can alter the third through its influence on the money supply. Those two core determinents are the entirely province of the judgements of individuals, who are the true owners of all resources. All that an institution can do, through its taking resources from those individuals and investing them, is either speed up or slow down the adjustment of what actual returns are generated to line up with what kind of returns people would prefer to have for the varying risk levels. “Assertion” and “reassertion” is just reference to the aggregate of individuals’ preferences being eventually reflected in how investments are made. Ultimately, individuals producers and consumers will not be denied, irrespective of what intermediating institutions do in the short term.

A reassertion will start forming in the works when an institution (including government) starts acting to increase investment in a manner that is not warranted by aggregate time preference and risk aversiveness. An institution can only do this either by, first, lowering its reserve fractions, or, second, the central bank inflating the fiat currency and giving the new money to the financial institutions.

The mechanics of the reassertion start churning even before the funds exit the bank. The institution is in competition with others, so to fend off that competition it lowers its interest rates for given risk levels, yet increases its profits through an increased volume made possible by raiding the reserves or free booty from the central bank. Other institutions follow suit to meet that competition (many do, some don’t), and so returns are eventually lowered across all risk levels. The reassertion becomes due because the risk-return profile actually receivable in the marketplace is at now odds with what the individuals who own the resources would prefer, but the process must play itself out for the reassertion to be made manifest.

This is the process. The insitution then gets a business customer who borrows extra funds from it. The business then spends the funds to buy extra labour and capital goods. The revenue from the purchase of capital goods then becomes yet more income to other labourers, plus additional profit for the suppliers, interest revenue for debt investors, and more spending on yet more capital goods by them in turn. That process goes on and on, over time, until all spending can be resolved into personal income as wages, profits, or interest. As those funds make their way into the hands of individuals as personal income, those individuals must then decide what they are going to do with their money. That decision, in aggregate, is the beginnings of the reassertion itself. They decide as described above, by chosing whether to invest or borrow depending on the prevailing actual RORs and their required ROR’s. But, the actions of the originating institutions caused actual returns to fall, so that inclines people to save and invest less on the one hand and to disinvest (including borrow) to spend on consumption on the other. This action means that financial institutions start experiencing a drain on their funding sources, because people aren’t saving and investing at the same level as before. However, they don’t notice it straight away because they are initially getting additional funding either by raiding the reserves or getting a cut of central bank largesse and because as noted it takes time for the funding to fully make its way to the hands of individuals (there are also other capital goods and labour markets difficulties, but that’s secondary to the question at hand). That means at the start of a boom they can afford to lower their interest rates and creditworthiness criteria, but without an increase in the raiding or booty-gathering the assertion of individuals’ time preferences and risk premiums will force them to undo it to cover the cost required in regaining that funding.

To make matters worse, the extra consumer spending causes consumer prices to rise. When this happens the inflation that was generated by the government or the fractional bank starts to show up. This then occasions people to start expecting more price rises in future, which then inclines them to increase their inflation premiums required to invest. In turn, that makes them increase their overall required ROR’s quite substantially, in turn worsening the drain on financial institutions’ deposits etc.

So, now we have a problem: the action of instititions has artificially lowered actual ROR’s while increasing required ROR’s, with the consequences of the inflation making this situation harder and harder for the institutions to maintain. The only way that this can be maintained is by an acceleration of the reserves raiding or fiat currency expansion - but that only eventually acts to increase general prices and expectations of future inflation, increasing actual-required gap even more. The whole thing collapses when the institutions relent and allow the market rates rise to match required rates, ending the raiding party and so curtailing lending to business. The reassertion of time preferences in this context is that part relating to financial institutions curtailing their lending activities down to the level warranted by the funding that individuals will provide.

And why do the businessmen who plan the investments believe that a low interest rate today means they are going to be able to borrow at the same low interest rate 5 years from now? An interest rate is a price, and I have never heard of any rational manager expecting any prices to remain unchanged for years in a free market. Whenever you make a business plan, you have to factor in the possibility of the price of your own product declining, and the prices asked for by your suppliers

There is a local zinc smelter project that opened earlier this year and was forced to close down just a few weeks ago because they projected zinc prices to remain high (they fell) and coal prices to remain low (they rose). They whined in the local paper that they would never have opened up the smelter had they known that prices would change. Why is it so hard to expand that kind of mentality to others doing likewise in consideration of interest rates? Not every manager is always completely rational.

In a totally free market, there can be some cyclicality in the supply of goods that take a long time to produce caused by their producers being unable to predict the number of their competitors.

Yes, but without intereference in the financial markets through manipulation of interest rates and the money supply all the different markets’ variations as you speak of would largely diversify against each other, leaving behind a rather minor “noise” signal on top of what would otherwise be an orderly non-boom period of smooth growth that would follow the changes in time preference and risk aversiveness, both of which would change slowly in a laissez-faire economy. The issue is why there is such an enormous correlation of everyone investing and disinvesting at the same time, why everyone’s expectations of risk and changes in purchasing power all move in unison across the whole economy. In a laissez-faire economy the only vehicle for that is the financial sector through changes in reserve ratios down or up, while in a fiat-currency economy it is currency expansion and contraction, either scenarios of which move interest rates down or up accordingly and messing with people’s plans.

But a much more important factor in causing economic cycles in our present-day mixed economy is government intervention.

Intervention interferes with investment because it lowers actual returns through jacking up costs and raising expected returns through making people increase their risk premiums to compensate or expectation of more such costs in future (which may go all the way to mean total loss of capital). One of the reasons why the markets are jittery right now is because the government officials haven’t sorted out exactly what they are going to do, which makes for risk and uncertainty that are too difficult to pin down all that well, making it much harder to evaluate existing and potential investments in the current economic climate.

This definitely makes a contribution to the economic cycle, but it is not the originator of the core cycle at work.

One statist interventions you can count on to stymie any boom is … the raising of interest rates.

The offending banks must eventually raise rates because it cannot keep on doing what it has to do to keep them that low. If the offender is the central bank, it cannot keep on accelerating fiat currency expansion because that is leading to general price increases. It is partially doing the right thing, but only as a hyper-crude approximation of what would happen in a free market. If the offender is a normal bank, it cannot keep rates low because this it must eventually run out of reserves to raid, or have its profits cut because it raises offered rates to get more reserves in, or face a run (starting with a mere walk, so to speak) because it is losing customers.

JJM

Thanks for that explanation, John; I’ve got a much clearer picture about what is meant by this “reassertion” thing now.

Let me ask you a question I also asked adrock before: Assuming a gold-based, laissez-faire economy, if a miner found a large bonanza of gold (and invested most of it into loans and bonds, causing a perceivable drop in interest rates) would a boom-bust sequence ensue? I mean, the new-found gold would eventually make its way into the incomes of individuals, who would have to decide what to do with it, just like the money lent by the banks you talked about. Since the actual return rates have fallen, they will be less inclined to invest than before, which means that the low rates will become difficult to maintain, unless the miners continue to find unusually big bonanzas. But gold production will inevitably return to its normal level sooner or later, ending the boom and causing a bust.

The fact is, we already know what would happen with a sudden surge of gold into the economy. When Spain conquered what is now Peru, they shipped back literally hundreds of tons of gold, and the result was price inflation (the symptom of inflating the money supply) in Spain, which later spread to the rest of Europe as the gold was traded by Spain.

Gold does not guarantee price stability. It does mean governments will find it much harder to monkey with the money supply.

(Time to pick on the Spaniards again. When platinum was discovered in what is now Colombia in the early 1700s, it was a nuisance; it was a bunch of heavy white nuggets mixed in with the yellow nuggets after panning (it is even denser than gold and won’t leave the pan during panning). It had to be painstakingly separated from the gold, nugget by nugget and typically grain by grain, and at the time was worthless, actually it had negative value since it cost money to get rid of it. Eventually, however, mint workers discovered that even though platinum could not be melted with the technology of the day, it would dissolve in molten gold, was even more dense, and just as acid resistant–it literally withstood the acid test. It was easy enough to get, say, a pound of that white junk, melt it into the gold, and pocket a pound of gold, with no one the wiser. Spain had to resort to *banning* platinum, and would buy it up at the site it was mined at. Later on when the Spanish government wanted to debase their currency they would put some platinum into their gold coinage. Much later (late 1800s) the value of platinum, due to discovered industrial applications, finally exceeded that of gold.)

I understand that all the gold ever mined would form a cube 65 feet on a side (about 20 meters). I’ve also seen that given as a weight (19.3 metric tons per cubic meter gives approximately 154,400 metric tons or almost 5 billion troy ounces, less than one ounce average for every person on the planet. (Hmm, I seem to have more than my “share” of the stuff. :stuck_out_tongue: )

Let me ask you a question I also asked adrock before: Assuming a gold-based, laissez-faire economy, if a miner found a large bonanza of gold (and invested most of it into loans and bonds, causing a perceivable drop in interest rates) would a boom-bust sequence ensue? I mean, the new-found gold would eventually make its way into the incomes of individuals, who would have to decide what to do with it, just like the money lent by the banks you talked about. Since the actual return rates have fallen, they will be less inclined to invest than before, which means that the low rates will become difficult to maintain, unless the miners continue to find unusually big bonanzas. But gold production will inevitably return to its normal level sooner or later, ending the boom and causing a bust.

Sorry Cap, I have been super busy the last few weeks. I wish I had more time, this conversation is enjoyable to me.

In short on this point: Gold need not be the only medium of exchange in a free economy. Your scenario implicitly denies the possibility that if gold production increases to a level where the supply of gold becomes overabundant, people will simply stop using gold as a medium of exchange. I hold that this is what will happen. If this is the case, then there need not be any boom-bust cycle.

But, even assuming that is not the case, there will be no boom-bust cycle, because the increased production of gold is an increase in production; that is, an increase in real wealth. You see that the Spain example provided by Steve is actually not an increase in the production of a free economy; it is an increase in looted/plundered “wealth” in a non-market economy, so the scenario is not particularly relevant.

But a similar (but smaller) inflationary effect was seen when gold began pouring out of California. You *do* get a price hike and it has *nothing* to do with any production (other than gold) increasing or decreasing. And it has nothing to do with looting in this case.

Certainly people can switch to something else, like silver. OBTW it has actually gotten cheaper, relative to gold, in the last 150 or so years. In the 1700s and early 1800s the ratio of value varied from 14:1 to 16:1, it’s now at something like 80:1. ($820.9:$10.53 as of this moment, I did a quick estimate.) Obviously an Objective system would not try to arbitrarily fix this ratio, such attempts always cause problems when the market ratio changes (one or the other type of coin is worth more than its face value, and disappears into the melting pot).

Let me ask you a question I also asked adrock before: Assuming a gold-based, laissez-faire economy, if a miner found a large bonanza of gold (and invested most of it into loans and bonds, causing a perceivable drop in interest rates) would a boom-bust sequence ensue?

Generally, across a major economy that is free, no, for two chief reasons.

The first is simply the fact that the effect would be spread out far and wide in short order. That would hold - and did hold - in the time of the Conquistadors. The effects of the influx of money would flow into the whole economy fairly quickly. Steve is right that there would be at least some monetary effect, but it would not be a major boom-bust-cycle-causing event. The reason is that as the value of gold as money drops it would be tempered by a withdrawal of gold from the money supply for jewellery or other industrial use - it is the prospect of doing just that at any time that gives objectivity to the use of gold coins. Even today, for instance, in Asia there is a lot of high-carat low-sentimental-value gold jewellery whose owners are perfectly willing to part with or add to depending on their opinion of how gold is going. That writ large would be present in a laissez-faire economy, and would buffer the monetary effects. That backs up what Adrock said about the mining being production of real wealth.

As to Spain, Adrock is right, there, too - Spain’s problem was its lack of freedom. By contrast to Spain’s living-by-plunder, the other countries upon whom they spent the money to buy goods from prospered in a more consistent manner. Yes, there was mild inflation because of gold and silver finds in the New World making their way to Europe, but the rate was so low that most didn’t even notice it. If memory serves me, Adam Smith noted that fact as one of the reasons why many a land-owning family found the real value of its contractually-negotiated income go down over time and not inclined to renegotiating the contracts.

Additionally, again IMSM, von Mises notes in the Theory of Money and Credit that even the big gold booms of the 19th century (California, Australia, South Africa) didn’t expand total gold stocks as much as a wild imagination would be inclined to believe - about 1 or 2%pa peak, I think? Today that would be even harder to maintain, because as Steve notes there is such an enormous amount of gold already mined and ready for use. A bonanza as you describe would have to be of astronomical proportions, both figuratively and literally (cf the nickel mine in Sudbury, Ontario).

The second reason is that gold, once mined, almost entirely stays in human hands forever thereafter, which is in stark contrast to the deflationary effect that banks’ needs to rebuild reserves would have (bank failures even more so). The reserve-building (or failures) in a central-bank-having economy reduces the money supply, necessitating general price decreases for markets to clear again, which messes with profitability because of longer-term contractually-negotiated prices. With gold there would be almost no such price decreases in net because the money supply would not be reduced anywhere near as substantially, with effects being a lot more isolated among particular businesses. After the extra-growth phase was over the come-down-phase would therefore be considerably more muted than were the economy not free, so much so that often it would just mean the economy was merely not growing as fast as it does on average but still growing! I believe that describes a large part of the 19th century US, where people were upset because economic growth fell to 3% from 8%, but I can’t remember where I got that statistic from.

JJM

The fact is, we already know what would happen with a sudden surge of gold into the economy. When Spain conquered

The fact that prices rose is not surprising to anyone who knows a little about supply and demand. But that was not the question. The question was whether there would be a boom and bust, a la Austrian cycle theory–i.e., whether producers would invest into projects based on the assumption that interest rates would continue to remain low, but then go bankrupt when time preferences “reasserted” themselves. A major assumption of the scenario is that the miners invest most of the gold into loans and bonds, thereby causing interest rates to drop–something I’m not sure the Spanish did.

Gold need not be the only medium of exchange in a free economy. Your scenario implicitly denies the possibility that if gold production increases to a level where the supply of gold becomes overabundant, people will simply stop using gold as a medium of exchange. I hold that this is what will happen.

But what do you mean by “overabundant” ? It is clear that if gold became as abundant as water, people would switch to something else. But it is also clear (to me, at least) that if the supply of gold rose by something like 2-3% per annum, there would be no switch. My scenario is about an addition to loanable gold that is sufficient to produce a perceivable drop in interest rates; I don’t think this needs to be much more than a couple per cent of the existing gold supply.

But, even assuming that is not the case, there will be no boom-bust cycle, because the increased production of gold is an increase in production; that is, an increase in real wealth. You see that the Spain example provided by Steve is actually not an increase in the production of a free economy; it is an increase in looted/plundered “wealth” in a non-market economy, so the scenario is not particularly relevant.

But how would you classify the action of banks in a free market economy? Are they looters or plunderers or something similar?

Generally, across a major economy that is free, no, for two chief reasons.

The first is simply the fact that the effect would be spread out far and wide in short order.

Why does it take longer with the gold lent by banks?

The second reason is that gold, once mined, almost entirely stays in human hands forever thereafter, which is in stark contrast to the deflationary effect that banks’ needs to rebuild reserves would have

Why do the banks need to rebuild their reserves?

First up, let me correct an error. The general price rises in Europe caused by Spanish plunder being spent there were not inflation. They were just a long process of price readjustments.

Why does it take longer with the gold lent by banks?

I’m sorry, but I don’t quite understand the question? It wouldn’t make any difference whether gold or fiat notes were money to the question of how quickly the effects of monetary expansion (from whatever cause) spread. The information and decisions flow from any one part of the world to another as fast as communication channels let them, and the physical money travels as fast as armoured vans on the roads go, both irrespective of what the money is made of.

Why do the banks need to rebuild their reserves?

Because in the downturn some people will have lost their jobs, some businesses will have net drains on their cash reserves because revenues fall faster than costs, and so forth. Everyone still needs to pay the bills, so money must still be spent despite a loss of money coming in. Before the bottom of the downturn, that means a net outflow of cash from savings until expenses are reduced sufficiently, and that’s without further consideration of people beginning to fear for the continued existence of their savings in the banks.

If the money supply is fractional then that drawdown is a drain on reserves because the percentage of cash outflow compared to total cash stocks is higher than the percentage of liability reductions to total outstanding liabilities. Say that a bank has a policy of 75% reserves. On deposit/note liabilities of 100m, the bank has 75m in specie sitting in a vault as reserve. Customers withdraw say 5m in specie, reducing both the stock of specie and the liabilities by that amount - but 5m is a higher proportion of 75m than it is of 100m. So, now there are reserves of 70m and liabilities of 95m, making the reserve fraction fall to 70/95 = 73.6%. If the bank is to keep its remaining customers it has to raise reserves back to 75%, which on 95m liabilities means adding 1,250,000 in specie to the reserves so that 71,250,000 / 95,000,000 = 75%.

JJM

I’m sorry, but I don’t quite understand the question? It wouldn’t make any difference whether gold or fiat notes were money to the question of how quickly the effects of monetary expansion (from whatever cause) spread. The information and decisions flow from any one part of the world to another as fast as communication channels let them, and the physical money travels as fast as armoured vans on the roads go, both irrespective of what the money is made of.

Well, I supposed that you implied the effect would not “be spread out far and wide in short order” in the case of the banks doing what you call “credit expansion”–that this was one of the differences between the latter and an increase in gold mining explaining why gold mining would not lead to a boom and bust and “credit expansion” would.

Because in the downturn some people will have lost their jobs, some businesses will have net drains on their cash reserves because revenues fall faster than costs, and so forth. Everyone still needs to pay the bills, so money must still be spent despite a loss of money coming in. […] Say that a bank has a policy of 75% reserves. On deposit/note liabilities of 100m, the bank has 75m in specie sitting in a vault as reserve. Customers withdraw say 5m in specie, reducing both the stock of specie and the liabilities by that amount - but 5m is a higher proportion of 75m than it is of 100m.

OK, so suppose I withdraw some gold to pay my bills. Where does that gold go? Isn’t the recipient likely to deposit it in his own bank, increasing that bank’s reserves–so that between the two banks, the reserves remain the same? What you seem to describe is a shift in preferences, from holding money on checking accounts towards holding money in gold–but I am not convinced that an economic downturn would cause such a change in preferences. There would be a change in the spread between production and consumption, yes, and that would reduce saveable income (or even turn it negative) but that is something different from what form people hold the funds for their transactional needs in.

First up, let me correct an error. The general price rises in Europe caused by Spanish plunder being spent there were not inflation. They were just a long process of price readjustments.

If you are asserting that I misused inflation to refer to the price increases, I concede your point (I generally try to use the phrase “price inflation” to specifically refer to the increase in prices that typically accompanies inflation); if you are trying somehow to assert that the increase in the gold supply was not inflationary, then I disagree. Inflation is *any* increase in the money supply, regardless of whether it’s done by running the printing press (for paper money) or by debasing the coinage (as done numerous times in the past) or by producing and putting more gold into circulation.

Well, I supposed that you implied the effect would not “be spread out far and wide in short order” in the case of the banks doing what you call “credit expansion”–that this was one of the differences between the latter and an increase in gold mining explaining why gold mining would not lead to a boom and bust and “credit expansion” would.

I had a look at my original words, and I wasn’t clear enough. My fault. I meant that the effects of a single bank’s expansion would spread far and wide in the time of the Conquistadors just as it would today. The difference between today and then is seconds versus a few weeks, where weeks is still quick enough in a free economy to prevent a major boom-bust cycle happening in the local area. Spain’s problem was law that hindered that from happening (they put bans on gold export, which just made internal prices rise and created incentives to smuggle imports in and gold out).

OK, so suppose I withdraw some gold to pay my bills. Where does that gold go?

Right where you said it does, into your pockets.

Isn’t the recipient likely to deposit it in his own bank, increasing that bank’s reserves–so that between the two banks, the reserves remain the same? What you seem to describe is a shift in preferences, from holding money on checking accounts towards holding money in gold–but I am not convinced that an economic downturn would cause such a change in preferences.

In time it would lead to the same, but there is always that delay. It is not a shift in preferences (unless bank solvency comes into question), just recognition of the fact that things don’t happen instantaneously. For so long as the downturn is still in progress the equilibrium of cash in meeting cash out wont be met. One of the markers of the bottom being reached is when that equilibrium is finally met.

In a non-fractional economy, the delay is very short because the money supply remains unchanged (gold stays in human hands after mining, as I noted). What having a fractional system does is make the end of the delay take longer to reach because the money supply itself is being diminished by the withdrawals, continuning to reduce revenues while the fall in expenses lags behind. The fact that the money supply is being diminished, and that actual reserves are consistently being below spec, can lead to people questioning the solvency of banks more strongly than were it not fractional, which then does change people’s preferences for the concrete methods by which they express their demand for money.

JJM

If you are asserting that I misused inflation to refer to the price increases

No, the error was mine in post #30 (para 3).

if you are trying somehow to assert that the increase in the gold supply was not inflationary, then I disagree. Inflation is *any* increase in the money supply, regardless of whether it’s done by running the printing press (for paper money) or by debasing the coinage (as done numerous times in the past) or by producing and putting more gold into circulation.

I’ve answered that already elsewhere, such as on this thread and this one.

JJM

But what do you mean by “overabundant” ? It is clear that if gold became as abundant as water, people would switch to something else. But it is also clear (to me, at least) that if the supply of gold rose by something like 2-3% per annum, there would be no switch. My scenario is about an addition to loanable gold that is sufficient to produce a perceivable drop in interest rates; I don’t think this needs to be much more than a couple per cent of the existing gold supply.

Cap, you are continuing to equate the production of a gold mine with the running of the printing press that occurs in a fiat system, but these two scenarios are really quite incomparable because they are radically different in nature.

The two scenarios that you keep setting up are antipodes. A gold mine increasing production is an increase in production, and an increase in production is an increase in real wealth. By illustrative contrast, an increase in fiat notes is NOT an increase in productive activity, it is an increase in phony wealth.

Increased gold mining is an increase in real wealth precisely because the gold miner has to find somebody to trade his gold with; that is to say, he can’t just walk out into the streets and declare by fiat that somebody accept his newly found gold. The gold miner has to find someone willing to exchange the products of his or her own productive effort for his newly mined gold. He is bound by the economic law that he has to exchange value for value. The fiat printer is not bound by this law, for he is able to exchange something of no value for something of value, and is therefore a cheat and a looter.

But how would you classify the action of banks in a free market economy? Are they looters or plunderers or something similar?

That’s easy. In a free market economy, all economic transactions are voluntary, and therefore there can be no legally permissible looting. A bank would simply be a business that produces a service which is valuable to those who voluntarily conduct business with it.

On the other hand, a central bank would be a looter and a plunderer, because it forces people at the point of a gun to conduct business with it.

OK, so suppose I withdraw some gold to pay my bills. Where does that gold go?

Right where you said it does, into your pockets.

But it only resides there temporarily, until I drive to the service providers’ offices and hand them the gold. And what will the service providers do with the gold? They will deposit it with their bank so they can pay their own bills when they become due. Out of the reserves of one bank, into the reserves of another–I see no net withdrawal taking place here. Money continues to circulate as the means of exchange just like it circulated before the boom began. There may be a net capital consumption taking place in the economy, but that is not the same thing as a net withdrawal of gold from transactional accounts. Capital includes all kinds of wealth, not just money–and when capital is being consumed, it is not the money that gets consumed.

Besides, I’m already granting you too much with the assumption that I am paying my bills by driving around with gold in my pockets. If I need to eat into my savings just to pay my bills, why would I want to make it worse by spending a lot of money on gas when I can pay my bills using just a little ink (or better still, electricity, as in online bill payments)? Cash-free forms of payment are usually more efficient than handing over gold in person, so I think it is a fair assumption that most people will prefer to use them in a rational society, and that bill payments will therefore, as a rule, take place without the need to withdraw gold. If you make that assumption, it becomes even clearer that capital consumption does not necessitate a net outflow of gold from the banking system.