Rational Sex

Psychology and Self Improvement Relationships, Love, Sex, Romance
21

Maybe it was just because the opportunities never arose. She had sex with everyone she wanted to, and the type of guys she loved went crazy for her like she was the ideal woman. What if she met more guys that fit her criteria? I think she would have had a lot more partners in that case.

The criteria is the highest value possible. The highest you can find. She only left Hank because someone signiificantly better came along. She wasn’t sleeping with everyone who met some minimum criteria. She was pursuing the best men she knew.

22

The criteria is the highest value possible. The highest you can find. She only left Hank because someone signiificantly better came along. She wasn’t sleeping with everyone who met some minimum criteria. She was pursuing the best men she knew.

Well say she(or someone else) constantly keeps finding a better man than the previous one. Every few months on average a new, better person comes to their attention and they want them instead.

What about Ayn Rand? She was married to Frank O’Connor who supposedly wasnt a great intellectual. She pursued him initially based on his physical appearance. Then when Nathaniel Branden came along, she was having sex with him too. Theres a contradiction to her values in there somewhere. Possibly because Ayn Rand was having sex with Nathaniel Branden, who at the time was closer to Ayn Rands ideal man, and was also with Frank. Why was she with Frank if she wanted the “best” man?

23

Well say she(or someone else) constantly keeps finding a better man than the previous one. Every few months on average a new, better person comes to their attention and they want them instead.

What about Ayn Rand? She was married to Frank O’Connor who supposedly wasnt a great intellectual. She pursued him initially based on his physical appearance. Then when Nathaniel Branden came along, she was having sex with him too. Theres a contradiction to her values in there somewhere. Possibly because Ayn Rand was having sex with Nathaniel Branden, who at the time was closer to Ayn Rands ideal man, and was also with Frank. Why was she with Frank if she wanted the “best” man?

Regarding finding a better every few months; without starting very very low on the “scale”, what do you think the chances of being able to do that are? Remember, I said significantly better. If you are focusing on some minor thing that’s better and using that for a reason to move on, then the problem is probably with your attention span. It needs to be a clear, better overall, kind of comparison. You can’t actually quantify people. Lisa is a 74 and suzi is a 76, therefore I must move on. It is a is clearly better then b in every significant way.

To continue with the Dagny example, she started with Francisco, and he left her. Not a choice she made. Then a decade later she found Hank who was a very productive man with some psychological inadequacies. The she found Galt. He was not a very productive man with a few less psychological issues. He was an incredibly productive man with very few, if any psychological problems. The jump was huge. Where could she go after that? Maybe a guy who is incredibly productive, saves the world, has no psychological problems, cooks an excellet creme brule, colonizes, the moon and then invents time travel, all without messing up his very great hair?

And, incidentally, finding someone better is not the only reason to leave someone. You should always be asking yourself if the persons influence on your life is good or bad overall.

I can’t answer for Ayn Rand, but from my distant and very outside point of view, I think what she did was wrong, and do not look to her life as an example of how best to handle ones love life. Her writings are a good deal more helpful.

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Regarding finding a better every few months; without starting very very low on the “scale”, what do you think the chances of being able to do that are? Remember, I said significantly better. If you are focusing on some minor thing that’s better and using that for a reason to move on, then the problem is probably with your attention span. It needs to be a clear, better overall, kind of comparison. You can’t actually quantify people. Lisa is a 74 and suzi is a 76, therefore I must move on. It is a is clearly better then b in every significant way.

But the man in my example is one who enjoys a new relationship not necessarily because its a significantly better person, but because its of equal or better quality AND mostly because its a new person. It may not be a short attention span either, since I think its well known that in the beginning of a relationship the feelings are usually the most intense. So his plan would be to not settle with “good” feelings, but instead with that “extraordinary” feeling from starting a new relationship(say every year or so, not every few months).

To continue with the Dagny example, she started with Francisco, and he left her. Not a choice she made. Then a decade later she found Hank who was a very productive man with some psychological inadequacies. The she found Galt. He was not a very productive man with a few less psychological issues. He was an incredibly productive man with very few, if any psychological problems. The jump was huge. Where could she go after that? Maybe a guy who is incredibly productive, saves the world, has no psychological problems, cooks an excellet creme brule, colonizes, the moon and then invents time travel, all without messing up his very great hair?

You son of a bitch, I still havent read the ending of AS. I should have said that earlier. About your comment though, what would Dagny do if John Galt died fairly soon? If she only chooses to have relationships with a better man than previously, than that would mean she cant have anymore guys the rest of her life. I personally think she would settle for Francisco or Rearden or someone like that if Galt dumped her or he died.

25

But the man in my example is one who enjoys a new relationship not necessarily because its a significantly better person, but because its of equal or better quality AND mostly because its a new person. It may not be a short attention span either, since I think its well known that in the beginning of a relationship the feelings are usually the most intense. So his plan would be to not settle with “good” feelings, but instead with that “extraordinary” feeling from starting a new relationship(say every year or so, not every few months).

The primary problem that I would expect, for the man in this scenario, is that he would be making decisions primarily by emotion. The high expereienced is primarily related to novelty and anticipation. So say he find a very excellent woman. Knows her for a year and is rationally convinced of her extraordinary charactor. Her year is almost over and he finds himself responding to another girl. She has a nice rack, is very fun to be with, etc. Whatever gets him going. He decides that she is the equal of the first girl in every way. The problem is, he actually knows very little about the new gal, and has filled in all of the gaps in his knowledge with best case scenario details. He doesn’t have an accurate picture. So he discards the first one, which he knows to be excellent, for one which he imagines to be “perfect” during the throws of his emotional bliss. In a world where most people were great dagnys and galts the odds for his emotional decision would be in his favor. In the world that I am familiar with, dagnys are hard to come by.

You son of a bitch, I still havent read the ending of AS. I should have said that earlier. About your comment though, what would Dagny do if John Galt died fairly soon? If she only chooses to have relationships with a better man than previously, than that would mean she cant have anymore guys the rest of her life. I personally think she would settle for Francisco or Rearden or someone like that if Galt dumped her or he died.

Sorry. I didnt realize. If galt died or dumped her for super-dagny, then she would still try to find the best that she could. You are not obliged to be with the best in existence…just the best you can find and get. If you are stuck on a desert island with one women…I’m gonna guess that she’ll be your “dagny” within about 3 months.

26

You son of a bitch,

Are you referring to aequalsa as an SOB in the nice,friendly, we’re having a conversation kind of way, or in the mean nasty you’re an A-Hole kind of way?

I would guess the former, but given the context I don’t think it’s appropriate either way. How could he have known you didn’t finish the book yet?

27

Are you referring to aequalsa as an SOB in the nice,friendly, we’re having a conversation kind of way, or in the mean nasty you’re an A-Hole kind of way?

If I were to hazard a guess, it would be like Fez from That 70’s show. Which is not really that nasty. I said it 'afore and I’ll say it ag’in, this thread has been done already. Do. A. Search.

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If I were to hazard a guess, it would be like Fez from That 70’s show. Which is not really that nasty. I said it 'afore and I’ll say it ag’in, this thread has been done already. Do. A. Search.

Wrong, it is like arnold schwarzenegger in one of those prank calls he is so fond of, though I can’t understand why.

RationalBiker is right in saying that could have used a little more context.

Also, what do you expect? If you don’t want to read spoilers then don’t read content about something you haven’t finished yet. Duh!

29

The primary problem that I would expect, for the man in this scenario, is that he would be making decisions primarily by emotion. The high expereienced is primarily related to novelty and anticipation. So say he find a very excellent woman. Knows her for a year and is rationally convinced of her extraordinary charactor. Her year is almost over and he finds himself responding to another girl. She has a nice rack, is very fun to be with, etc. Whatever gets him going. He decides that she is the equal of the first girl in every way. The problem is, he actually knows very little about the new gal, and has filled in all of the gaps in his knowledge with best case scenario details. He doesn’t have an accurate picture. So he discards the first one, which he knows to be excellent, for one which he imagines to be “perfect” during the throws of his emotional bliss. In a world where most people were great dagnys and galts the odds for his emotional decision would be in his favor. In the world that I am familiar with, dagnys are hard to come by.

Yeah, it is a little too risky. The man in my example is similar to being a thrill seeker.

Sorry. I didnt realize. If galt died or dumped her for super-dagny, then she would still try to find the best that she could. You are not obliged to be with the best in existence…just the best you can find and get. If you are stuck on a desert island with one women…I’m gonna guess that she’ll be your “dagny” within about 3 months.

I agree with the first part. The desert island example, it depends what woman is on the desert island with me, as long as shes not a real lunatic or a nagger, then we would most likely be at least good friends.

30

Are you referring to aequalsa as an SOB in the nice,friendly, we’re having a conversation kind of way, or in the mean nasty you’re an A-Hole kind of way?

I would guess the former, but given the context I don’t think it’s appropriate either way. How could he have known you didn’t finish the book yet?

It was said in a joking way. I know he didnt know I didnt read the ending of AS.

Listen to this if you want to know what I was thinking of when I wrote it: http://www.celebrityprankcalling.com/downl…hp?id_files=120

31

It was said in a joking way. I know he didnt know I didnt read the ending of AS.

No offense was taken, by the way. I’ve worked in construction for the better part of my life, so you can imagine it would take a bit more creativity to ruffle my feathers. Shoot! SOB is pretty much a term of endearment in my line of work. No worries.

32

Wrong, it is like arnold schwarzenegger in one of those prank calls he is so fond of, though I can’t understand why.

You called it, it seems. Was the use of “Wrong” also an Arnold-prank-call reference?

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Was the use of “Wrong” also an Arnold-prank-call reference?

No.

34

Well Im trying to figure out if having sex with a lot of (rational) people is a form of hedonism. Having sex with a lot of partners who you love doesnt seem to go against what Ayn Rands depiction of what sex should be, but it might fit the definition of hedonism because all it really is is seeking short term joy. But what benefits would a long term relationship with someone give you as opposed to many short term relationships?

Hedonism is an ethical philosophy which holds that pleasure (in the short term, from the Greek hedone, as opposed to eudaimonia, which meant long term happiness or well being) is the appropriate standard for morality. Seeking pleasure is not necessarily hedonism. It’s only hedonism if pleasure is the standard by which all of one’s decisions are made.

I think it would be impossible to show that one could only be motivated to have sex with a lot of rational people as a result of hedonistic premises.

35

I believe that sex is too much when you are having it 4-5 a day.