This is true, but does not tell us very much in the context of this conversation.
“Material objects as such have neither value nor disvalue; they acquire value-significance only in regard to a living being—particularly, in regard to serving or hindering man’s goals.” - Ayn Rand
Let’s examine this quote, for example. Now, something you want to acquire by cheating does not have a value as such. It is only a value if it is pursued or acquired in a certain way, and in a certain context.
Another question: you said that something is a value if it objectively further’s one’s life. I assume you mean that the value you chose, then, was chosen by attending to the facts of reality. Would you agree with this?
And then, consider this: what is the relationship between cheating or lying, and facts of reality?
I agree that material values chosen must be accordance with the facts of reality. I’m not sure I agree that cheating to gain such values once chosen is against the facts of reality. The liar is acknowledging all facts of reality himself, but occasionally presents certain facts as otherwise to other people.
An example would be Mark Zuckerberg. The man is clearly a productive genius who has created billions of dollars of value for himself and his customers. However he is also a liar. If it wasn’t for a few well chosen and well timed untruths, he would have forgone billions of dollars as other people beat him to setting up Facebook.
An example would be Mark Zuckerberg. The man is clearly a productive genius who has created billions of dollars of value for himself and his customers. However he is also a liar. If it wasn’t for a few well chosen and well timed untruths, he would have forgone billions of dollars as other people beat him to setting up Facebook.
That’s all well and good, but this is focusing on material values. There is no mention of any spiritual value (non-physical like positive state of mind or a relation with a person), primarily long-term happiness. You cannot simply reduce honesty to matters of lying or not lying, and if you’re only wondering about lying here, well, there is no real argument to make against you. It’s true, a few lies can get you what you want. As a simple matter of means and ends, you aren’t wrong. However, what spiritual values are being acquired and/or altered? How is being dishonest with some people in order to make lots of money better for enhancing values to the greatest degree than being honest and making less money?
I agree that material values chosen must be accordance with the facts of reality. I’m not sure I agree that cheating to gain such values once chosen is against the facts of reality. The liar is acknowledging all facts of reality himself, but occasionally presents certain facts as otherwise to other people.
An example would be Mark Zuckerberg. The man is clearly a productive genius who has created billions of dollars of value for himself and his customers. However he is also a liar. If it wasn’t for a few well chosen and well timed untruths, he would have forgone billions of dollars as other people beat him to setting up Facebook.
The liar is not acknowledging all facts of reality. Lying is a deliberate rearrangement of reality is an untruthful way in order to present it to other people. Deliberately rearranging one’s view of reality like this is not conducive to living a rational, reality-oriented life. You might as well have said “the robber is acknowledging the principle of individual rights to himself, but he occasionally acts otherwise around other people.”
How is being dishonest with some people in order to make lots of money better for enhancing values to the greatest degree than being honest and making less money?
In the case of Zuckerberg (or any other lie that involves billions of dollars) is it really better to maintain one’s self respect than lose out on the opportunity? Isn’t it worth the cognitive dissonance and distaste of lying in order to gain a billion dollars?
You might as well have said “the robber is acknowledging the principle of individual rights to himself, but he occasionally acts otherwise around other people.”
I think I’m beginning to see why lying is wrong. I think my problem is something to do with me having an abstract idea of ethics in my head that is separate from how I act in real life, ie not putting into practise my ideas. But I’m still not completely clear on this.
In the case of Zuckerberg (or any other lie that involves billions of dollars) is it really better to maintain one’s self respect than lose out on the opportunity? Isn’t it worth the cognitive dissonance and distaste of lying in order to gain a billion dollars?
Why exactly is there any distaste of lying going on?
I think I’m beginning to see why lying is wrong. I think my problem is something to do with me having an abstract idea of ethics in my head that is separate from how I act in real life, ie not putting into practise my ideas. But I’m still not completely clear on this.
I recommend some time thinking about it a lot more every day for a little while, and observe instances of people being dishonest (it’s everywhere, shouldn’t be a problem) and try to find out what it does for them in terms of living a rational, reality-oriented life. And try to reduce the principle that honesty is good back to perceptual reality. Ask yourself: “What other concepts would I need to know/grasp in order to understand what honesty is and why it is good? And what would I need to know in order to understand those concepts?” And after a while, you will have traced the conceptual hierarchy back to its roots in observation.