Value in Imperialism

[volco]

I know i haven't answered the other thread i initiated but i'm on a business trip and with little to no time, so here it goes

1) If colonial administration was the precursor of the then "home" welfare state, then how Oism deals with the value of Imperialism itself? Particularly the British Empire which made both colonizer and cololnized better off- wealthier economically culturally and civilization-wise? (it was both ways, an important mathematical number, shampoo, cricket comes from India, just as rule of law and representation was imposed in India by the mainland)

Since this is a specific let's compare the British Empire of India, to French Indochina. Burma and Burmese were MUCH better off during colonial times while Vietnam is thriving after they liberated from the obnoxious French.

2) Can I hail "God Save the Queen" while not believing neither in god nor in monarchy? What that be the essence of post-modernism? Or/And of Symbolism?

[Jake_Ellison]

Particularly the British Empire which made both colonizer and colonized better off- wealthier economically culturally and civilization-wise?

Imperialism has no value. Luckily, the British Empire also had valuable ideas, such as reason, trade, the rule of law, etc. None of these are characteristics of Imperialism. Imperialism means tyranny.

So the British Crown, to the extent that it spread Western civilization and values, was often a good influence (for instance this colonialist expansion brought about the North-American civilization. But after that an end to colonialism was also a good thing (for instance in the US).

Other times, it wasn't a good thing at all. It was especially vicious when people of different races were the subjects of colonization, because of the widespread racism among Europeans.

One thing is clear. The British Empire was never a good thing because of its Imperialism, but because of its other values. If instead of Imperialism, it would've imposed the kind of (temporary) occupation America imposed on Japan, the colonies(and Britain, in the long run) would've been even better off.

[volco]

Imperialism has no value. Luckily, the British Empire also had valuable ideas, such as reason, trade, the rule of law, etc. None of these are characteristics of Imperialism. Imperialism means tyranny.

So the British Crown, to the extent that it spread Western civilization and values, was often a good influence (for instance this colonialist expansion brought about the North-American civilization. But after that an end to colonialism was also a good thing (for instance in the US).

Other times, it wasn't a good thing at all. It was especially vicious when people of different races were the subjects of colonization, because of the widespread racism among Europeans.

One thing is clear. The British Empire was never a good thing because of its Imperialism, but because of its other values. If instead of Imperialism, it would've imposed the kind of (temporary) occupation America imposed on Japan, the colonies(and Britain, in the long run) would've been even better off.

The value I see in Imperialism is the expansion of a higher level of civilization towards a lower one.

The British Empire is by far the best example. Jake, I respect your knowledge of history, and so, can you please specify which cases and FORM of racism the British underwent?

Black Rhodesians (which were not native anyway, but went there voluntarily because of the colony's prosperity) were much better off under "racist" Ian Smith than under Uncle Mugabe. Not to speak about white Rhodesians.

I can say the same about Burma.

In the case of America, I share your thoughts and would love to see Australia turned into a (real) Republic. I don't like the guy nor the party that wanted to do so, but Australia doing the same as America did 200 years ago is the onlye l idea I do share with the late Hutchinson. ap

You are (very) mistaken by comparing British Imperialism, with America's self defense actions, including the occupation, of Japan and Western Germany. I don't think I need to explain the reasons but will do if necesarry.

[Devils_Advocate]

2) Can I hail "God Save the Queen" while not believing neither in god nor in monarchy? What that be the essence of post-modernism? Or/And of Symbolism?

You can certainly hail "God Save the Queen" without believing in God, in the same way that you can say "Thank God", "Oh My God", "In God we Trust", "God Bless You", etc. etc. God does not always have a spiritual connotation. I think Ayn Rand wrote something on this once, but I'm not sure... I think she had said that God can be a term for a generalized ideal, or highest ideal ... something like that... can anyone double check that for me?

Meanwhile, on the monarchy issue, that one is much harder. If you are opposed, unilaterally, to any system of monarchy, regardless of the degree of the monarch's power, than I don't think so. Unless "God Save the Queen" is seen more as an expression of British loyalty and culture, in which case, I imagine so. After the british royalty are deposed, for lack of a better word, I doubt they'll stop playing it.

Personally, I always preferred "Hail Britannia".

[freestyle]

... I think Ayn Rand wrote something on this once, but I'm not sure... I think she had said that God can be a term for a generalized ideal, or highest ideal ... something like that... can anyone double check that for me?

I assume that is likely what you're referring to.

[softwareNerd]

The value I see in Imperialism is the expansion of a higher level of civilization towards a lower one.

By imperialism do you mean colonization, including situations like the U.S. in Philippines? Do you also include the Soviet post-WW2 control of Eastern Europe?

[dollardoctrinaire]

I've heard some people talk about "neo-imperialism", where instead of countries planting flags on other countries, they send in their corporations to utilize the markets of other countries. What are your comments on this? My take is "boo hoo, so American corporations operate in Third World countries, so what? They create jobs (the so-called sweat shops) and help the American economy". Sounds good to me.