Me, Trying To Remain As Rational As I Can

[Som Guy]

I have come here in hopes that whenever I happen to come upon some contradiction I can't see my own way out of or something that I know to be true yet do not understand the exact reasons behind it I can find an answer here. My experiance in coming to Objectivism has been rather rough, mostly unneccesarily, but I am throughly pleased with the current state of my life.

I'm quite ashamed to admit that a year ago today I was still a avid believer in Christianity. I had disagreed a lot with the ideas it preaches, but took those as signs of me being an evil person. I didn't bother asking why these things were true, because the same answer I always got was "the bible says so." I assumed that this document had some sort of reason or explaination I couldn't grasp and let that idea satisfy me without ever checking it's validity. As soon as I did start reading it I realized what horrible of a mistake I had been making.

Once free from this belief I stumbled blindly for what is true. I came to the assumption that nothing could be absolutly proven to be true, aside from logic, which I still believe. Starting from the basic truths that have to be true, such as "A is A" and that I have to exist in some shape or form because I have to exist in order to do anything, which I obviously am as I am pondering that very question. But unlike most people who believe this, I realize that all that means is this world is ethier my imagination, or real. There is no point in assuming I'm a raving lunatic imagining away his own little world without any reason to. I do however have a very good reason to believe that the world I precieve is reality because as of yet, doing such has kept me alive. I do not see how I could still remain alive if I am fumbling around in my dream world. So I trust my senses so long as they do follow logic. If I precieve a contradiction, I know that I'm ethier hallucinating psychologically or have been decieved. The chain of what I believe goes in the order of: logic, perceptions, logical conclusions made from firsthand preceptions, all othe logical conclusions based on the previous conclusion, information recieved secondhand from others, logical conclusions made integrating things already known and the secondhand information. When I find a contradiction I start at the least certain assumption made. I do not know how this differs from Objectivist Epistomology, as I haven't quite gotten around to reading the book on it... it's sitting there but it makes so many refrences to other philosphies and philosophical ideas that it's been a challenge to read.

I went through my life from then until a few months later trying to figure out what I should think until my older brother reccomened to me that I read Fountainhead, which he had read for the essay contest held by the ARI, saying "This guy(Howard) is just like you." Now at this stage I was far from being such a logical and great being as Howard, but still the closest thing he had seen to him. I started reading and found it very very useful. It gave me reasons behind the things I felt to be true all along and helped me realize a lot about morality and altruism.

Around my completion of the book an assignment was given to me by my English teacher that seems to me to be the conerstone of my self-esteem. The assignment was to "do two hours of selfless service and write about your experiance and how it helped you to grow as a person." At this time I had started to read Atlas Shrugged, which only reaffirmed to me the principles I now know to be true. Well I refused to do the assignment as such and wrote a paper instead on the futility of such an assignment, explaining the lack of virtue in selfless acts and how they cannot possibly make someone "grow as a person." I presented it to a standing ovation of my classmates. This is one of the greatest memories of my life, not because of their approval, but because of this was the first time I ever I had said this is what is right, this is why it is right, and I am completely certain of it. The teacher however gave me no credit for the assignment, which I expected and accepted as I did not do what was asked of me. I didn't think about it then, but I should have asked what 2 hours of selfless service has to do with my education in English.

Since that day I have been trying to read and learn as much as I can about Objectivism and here I am. I didn't really mean to write such a long post

[stephen_speicher]

Around my completion of the book an assignment was given to me by my English teacher that seems to me to be the conerstone of my self-esteem.  The assignment was to "do two hours of selfless service and write about your experiance and how it helped you to grow as a person."  At this time I had started to read Atlas Shrugged, which only reaffirmed to me the principles I now know to be true.  Well I refused to do the assignment as such and wrote a paper instead on the futility of such an assignment, explaining the lack of virtue in selfless acts and how they cannot possibly make someone "grow as a person."  I presented it to a standing ovation of my classmates.  This is one of the greatest memories of my life, not because of their approval, but because of this was the first time I ever I had said this is what is right, this is why it is right, and I am completely certain of it.

That is a great story. I applaud you, as your classmates did, for understanding and doing what was right.

The teacher however gave me no credit for the assignment, which I expected and accepted as I did not do what was asked of me.  I didn't think about it then, but I should have asked what 2 hours of selfless service has to do with my education in English.

Exactly. The teacher should have been reprimanded.

Since that day I have been trying to read and learn as much as I can about Objectivism and here I am.

Welcome, and I wish you the best in your continued studies.

p.s. If you will, one suggestion. It makes it difficult to read what you write when you string everything together. Please try to break your thoughts up into separate paragraphs. I bet more people will read what you write if you write that way.

[Som Guy]

Thanks for the suggestion, it did look rather bad as such a large string of sentences.

[BetTheFarm]

That is a great story. I applaud you, as your classmates did, for understanding and doing what was right.

I agree...great story! Your paper must have been very well structured and delivered to be accepted by your class in the way you describe. Feel free to share it with us, if you would like.

[Som Guy]

I agree...great story!  Your paper must have been very well structured and delivered to be accepted by your class in the way you describe.  Feel free to share it with us, if you would like.

Actually though I did deliver my paper very well, there are many flaws in my paper that I know of, though it would be nice to have people critique it. Perhaps I will share it, once I have some access to it. Right now my power is out due to hurricane Frances, so I cannot get the file off of my computer.

I think the reaction of my class was more of just a reaction to me standing up for my personal convictions than what was said in my paper as most of them probably couldn't understand what I was talking about, though I guess I could just be underestimating them.

[Som Guy]

Well you asked for the essay, and I don't feel it is up to par for the essay section so I'm putting it here:

Essay on civic duty

I have had some problems with the assignment given. It is my opinion that no act is “selfless”, “kindness” is just coincidence or needing something from other people, and that personal growth can only be achieved through reflection upon oneself. For these reasons and some others too small to mention I have abstained from completing this assignment.

First of all there are no “selfless” acts because there is no way to do something for someone without wanting to. You do the act because you want to. Now the reason why you want to can be nearly anything, but most often it is because you enjoy it. You enjoy making or having other people happy. Now is that what being selfless is? Is selflessness just leaching off of others happiness? Is selflessness the need to make or have others around you happy? Is this need supposed to be considered a virtue? If you do not have this need does that make you unkind?

However there are other motives for helping people, on of which is guilt. Due to the society around us people may feel like they are a bad person if they do not help others. Is guilt about not needing somebody a good thing? Is it something that we should feel shame about and dislike about ourselves? Is it selfless to dislike ourselves? Is it kind?

Though it does not surface often, there are times when you enjoy helping people because you are doing something you enjoy. In this case you don’t have any desire to help someone you just do by coincidence. Does the other person involved somehow make you a better person? Do they make you selfless? Do they make you kind?

Now the last motive is the worst one of all, the need to appear selfless. Though very similar to the motive just mentioned it has a major difference, instead of feeling guilty yourself you feel like those around you are thinking bad of you. The move is from a victim to a liar when you try to make others believe you are selfless. You help others only so those people will think well of you. The simple fact of needing others acceptance is revolting, if you are fine with who you are then why does what they think of you matter? Is it selfless to put other people’s opinions above your own? Is it kind?

Lastly the notion that you can grow as a person from this event is absurd. Wanting other people to be happy, feeling guilty, coincidence, or valuing other opinions above your own will not make you grow as a person. The only way to grow as a person is to think about yourself. Think about yourself and decide if you are happy with whom you are. After all, exactly what type of person would we want to be aside from the person we want to be?

So in conclusion, there is nothing selfless about helping other people, as there is no way to be selfless at all, and self-reflection is the only way to better yourself.

Like I said, even I can point out some small mistakes in my writing now.

[Oakes]

Som Guy,

I just read through this thread and I want to welcome you to the forum. You shouldn't dwell on any philosophical mistakes you made in that essay; it was a great achievement. My experience in school has been that most people wouldn't even recognize the problem, much less have to ability to formulate a response and deliver it to the class. (BTW what grade did you right this in?)

It really hit a core when you said, "My experiance in coming to Objectivism has been rather rough, mostly unneccesarily, but I am throughly pleased with the current state of my life." Before 7th grade, I was pretty religiously active. But after coming across a rebellious nihilistic website, I set off on a 5-year stage of my life where I completely rejected religion. Problem was, I had nothing to replace it with. Those five years were absolute turmoil, one belief system replacing another. The only thing that stayed constant was the defiant school essays I wrote.

In one sense, I am glad I was philosophically active, because I wouldn't have reached Objectivism if I wasn't. But while I had something my classmates missed, I also missed something my classmates had: a social life. Now that I'm in 12th grade I'm still suffering from the psychological effects that had (depression), but nevertheless I'm throughly pleased with the current state of my life.

[Som Guy]

(BTW what grade did you right this in?)

I wrote it my sophmore year in High School.

But while I had something my classmates missed, I also missed something my classmates had: a social life.

Hey, as far as I see, if your classmates had a false sense of what is right.... then you didn't really miss much by not being social with them

[Oakes]

Hey, as far as I see, if your classmates had a false sense of what is right.... then you didn't really miss much by not being social with them

These days, you're right: I couldn't bare to associate with brainless people. But when you're young, you're supposed to be able to goof off with friends even though you'd sooner ignore them on serious matters.