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Snow_Fox last won the day on October 26 2011

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  1. The original article is interesting if not awkward thinking at some points. I would argue the house analogy needs a lot of work as well... If you find a more efficient way to build a house, there is nothing lazy about it.. In fact I would argue this is inspired by very motivated and active thinking. If you build a house faster, you can build another house sooner and you have become productive. I will definitely agree there is a major problem with lazy thinking as you call it.. A lot of my friends have beliefs and refuse to hear a logical argument against it, simply because they would then have to think, see the flaw in their logic and then correct it. The biggest issue, is when we discuss "over listening to music" I think we have to keep in mind I listen to say.. Pain Redefined by Disturbed and reflect on it think about it.. I actually hear the words.. Where as all of my friends listen to.. oh... I don't know.. 0.o um... Lets just say insert generic rap here.... They can listen to the song 50 times on repeat and have diminishing value in the song.. Because the song was only a back ground track for whatever they were doing in the first place. The over all point I am making is that there was a point you missed in your discussion where "the smart get smarter, the unthinking keep refusing to think". I don't watch T.V. If I do I actively watch T.V. What I am watching has some value to me and I am watching it for a reason. A lot of people just go brain dead and zone out while watching the boob tube. Then again, I like playing video games which require thought more than watching T.V.
  2. I can't give any peer reviewed scientific journals. I will leave it at this argument. You don't believe in a flying spaghetti monster. You know matter how much you want to, can't really believe in such a creature, you can't choose to believe it because you know it doesn't exist. I will concede the point about respecting their right vs respecting their beliefs. I don't want pointlessly argue but, I will say this. Being punished for doing wrong and rewarded for doing right is a precondition for everything learning right from wrong, be it children or dogs. If there was no possible way to do wrong before they ate the fruit, then regardless of what Eve said, it would have only been her regurgitating something that she didn't understand in the first place. You can leave a tape recorder going in front of a parrot that talks about theoretical physics. If done right the parrot might even be able to repeat information or mention it when it is relevant. That doesn't mean the parrot understands anything that he is saying at all.
  3. Because, there is a disgustingly large and growing base of Christians who believe that the bible isn't just supernatural, but something that can scientifically be proven? In the case of the link I included above.. there is what is actually suppose to be a human/dinosaur footprint overlapping. I am guessing that they assume humans and dinosaurs living within the same time automatically proves a god exist.
  4. *** Mod's note: Merged with a similar topic. - sN *** During a conversation with a Christian I was linked to this http://www.prorege-f..._source=message and some two hour long video on creationism by Kevin Hovind I believe is his name.. Sadly I still have a headache just thinking about the last video "proving creation" I watched which put forth no scientific arguments and just used the same escape mechanisms he complained about evolutionist using. I was just wondering how much evidence is there in favor of creationism, and are there any good resources on proving/disproving it.
  5. Michele.. that source makes less sense the more I read it. Children only learn and understand what they are and are not allowed to do by personal experience, and in most cases being punished for doing wrong. It is all about experience, which they would not have had.
  6. I think the major point I was making, which is they had no frame of reference for what "bad" would be. How were they to know dying wasn't the best thing since spliced rib woman? Everyone is subject to flawed thinking. I've come to realize you don't really choose what you believe, therefore even if I disagree with it, I should at least respect the fact that they believe it. Otherwise I won't be able to have a conversation and convince them otherwise. If they refuse to listen to all reason no matter what.. then Its time to move on and let them live in their world.
  7. I'm sorry after reading all of that.. I never really saw a point.. I felt like you did an interpretive dance where you literally circled around a point without ever getting to it. Could you please, in one or two sentences explain why a gold standard is bad? You made a lot of (as far as I can tell.. unfounded claims). While I find gold to be a somewhat silly unit of currency... at least with the gold standard there is a given amount of value to a dollar.. a direct worth to the money. Then again, I personally believe bullets and antibiotics are the only real unit of currency that matter.
  8. Something I had never thought about before, but saw argued recently was that in situations where people become rich to a degree that is incredibly disproportionate to the general population. They then gain the ability to invest in any given thing they want and create bubbles, which will then pop and cause everyone who was in the bubble and got a job, salary and living wages from that bubble to then lose everything they invested into the bubble. Meanwhile, they never risk their own comfortable lifestyle. An example here is if you have a billion dollars, throw 500 million into a failed business endeavor.. You can temporarily employ people, pay for the business venture.. And still have it totally flop. You still have 500 million, but you've displaced a lot of jobs, possible even people who move to take part in your business venture and you may even move them away from jobs they had already, that may not be waiting there when they get back.
  9. A bit close minded I think :/ If they went to this school, then I would presume they actually wanted to do better in the bed room themselves. I would actually have to respect that fact. You might be surprised how many women out there are fairly clueless about sex, and believe it is solely the responsibility of the man to rock her world. Not saying that the school is a great idea..
  10. I have very mixed feelings on this. On one hand I believe people should have the right to do what they want with their own body. On the other.. I start to wonder about people who get in the situation they are in due to a lifestyle they know is destructive to begin with. If I had a child and for some reason I couldn't give them my organs.. I would want to be able to buy them an organ.. I would try to in a heart beat if possible.. On the other hand.. I watch my parents drink, smoke and wreck their bodies nightly.. And the idea that they could just buy another organ to wreck is really well.. disgusting.
  11. Ayn Rand said herself. “Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it. Do not count on them. Leave them alone.” And "Do not ever say that the desire to "do good" by force is a good motive. Neither power-lust nor stupidity are good motives." The truth is we can not force people to be rational beings. I believe female circumcision is a horrific thing done to girls and I abhor that it happens. However, I can not force the people who practice it to understand that it is "bad" when they believe it is "good". And to say we should declare war on countries who allow it to be practiced is just begging for exploitation and marked with imperialism. Maybe one day I will travel to countries and try to educate people and maybe I will have some luck in getting the practice stopped.. but, war would not change anything. Forcing our ideals and values on other people will not work. For all of these reasons.. I firmly believe the Iraqi citizens will not be any better off after the U.S. invasion. The truth is, even with Saddam gone, they will still cling to what many of us consider backwards ways of life. It is so easy to point to dictators and place the blame squarely there.... but, we quickly over look cultural differences which shouldn't be so quickly swept under the rug. It bothers me that there are a lot of horrible things going on in the world, but the reality of the situation is there is nothing we can do to stop all infringements on human rights.
  12. After some thought on the subject, I've come to wonder if perhaps our congress is outdated. I realize that we as voters elect the members of congress however, how effectively can congress discuss the issues going on in the current time? We now have a growing number of issues like SOPA where I have to wonder how effectively can any of the current congress members can really understand, much less explain to those who do not understand the SOPA bill and why it is good or bad. For that matter when it comes to issues involving piracy, arguments tend to be one sided "MONEY LOST PIRACY BAD MAKE ILLEGAL". How do we create more room for rational conversation? Is there any reasonable way to remedy this situation?
  13. I do think there is a problem. I hesitate to comment on the Occupy Wallstreet movement too quickly because I have been having loads of trouble making sense of anything going on with it.. I think the ultimate truth, is there is just a group of people who don't know what to do, say, or think anymore. They just want things to get fixed and don't care how it is done.
  14. Actually going from the conversation I'm having right now with a kid on facebook.. You can't defend biblical authority even with biblical authority. I mean from Genesis forward.. you set yourself up for failure.. I even did the kids a favor and went with the assumption the bible is right. I just pointed out that Adam and Eve were expected to know right from wrong before they ate from the fruit.. and the kid is going a round in circles defending it.. I drew a comparison to a blind child being punished for using a red crayon.. And he said it doesn't make sense XD Even though without knowledge of right and wrong.. they would have been morally blind and not known it was evil to eat from the fruit... Also to poorly quote Richard Dawkins "If absolute morality involves stoning people for having sex and murdering children for disobeying, I don't want absolute morality"
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