Dagny

over 30,000 posts ....and 1,000 members....wow ! good job!

great essay! really enjoyed the personal touch you gave to it. I too used to talk to ceilings and felt completely uncomfortable when my christian friends urged me to pray with them aloud. i was never religious though-hardly ever went to church. I met a couple of atheists in high school with whom I had fervent debates with about the existence of God. I too feel naive about that now. After reading the Fountainhead I looked into Objectivism. But, like you, found it hard at first to deny God. It's just so ingrained with you. I wrote that night in my diary that I'd rather be happy believing in God ...an imaginary friend as he may be than be an atheist. I re-read that the next morning and felt horrible having even wrote such an atrocity. Blissful ignorance. After that I read Atlas Shrugged and half way through it realized I'd been an atheist for a long time.... just had been too scared to admit to myself.

redfarmer- stated that exact way...I agree with you completely. As for Sherlock, I cannot answer for him but I think he just said that in response to those who always use the Galt example to support the thought that all suicide can be life-affirming. Many of us have been introduced to Ayn Rand through her fiction and see her characters as role models....myself included.

thanks for the review. i wasn't going to see this movie having been put off by the first ocean's eleven...but perhaps I will check it out. I am looking forward to seeing Lemony Snicket and the Phantom of the Opera.

The originator of this thread did not make any comments to say that this was suicide in the hypothetical sense at all. As far as I knew only realistic cases of Socrates and the Founding Fathers were talked about. If you are talking hypothetically then one could even argue for morality in killing (as was suggested in another thread...a life boat situation). But I certainly do not agree with considering suicide in real life and calling it life-affirming.

I dont think he meant in the way you are taking it. Galt and Dagny were living in a completely irrational society....as bad as our world is I doubt it would ever get to that stage. Dagny was the last value John Galt had. Also, you should remember that even though Ayn Rand's own husband died ...she lived on well after him and even talked about how if she believed in after-life she would committ suicide in an instant...but she didn't believe in it...only believing in this life...and thus didn't. That is what I try to remember most....when thinking of any loved-one's death.

i have not been on the forum recently as I've been studying for finals. Megan- was going to give a long reply to your posts but I think Sherlock has done a great job at doing that already. Regarding my signature, the reason I chose it is exactly because I believe life is the only moral choice. Being alive and living a true Life are not equal...as I have learned from Ayn Rand....but suicide prevents you from ever being able to achieve anything...true Life included. Sorry to hear about your depression. I too suffered from depression in my teens. However, my depression stemmed from traumatic events that occurred in my childhood and which I have been able to get past. Sherlock-my younger brother (whom I am very close to) recently attempted to committ suicide. You have all my sympathy and I admire your strength, courage and love of life. I only hope to have as much when a family member passes away.

Welcome to the forum Dan!

Thanks for the great replies everyone. West- completely agree with you about pride. I can remember loving the challenge of outdoing my previous achievements even as a child...just the idea of learning something new...a language or skill or whatever. What made me start this thread was not just my husband but also because I'd heard on other threads users talk about their own logical, rational friends who'd read Ayn Rand's works and had not been as enthralled as they. Like they just "didn't get it" or understood it but didn't accept it. I have always loved biographies of great people...inventors, astronauts, founding fathers... so I suppose I was always a hero-worshipper...but beyond that I wanted to be a hero myself....still do. I want to make my own contribution to change this world. But before I read Ayn Rand...i thought of myself as a complete loner... my husband when we first met even called me a megalomaniac. But its not about being famous or anything...just doing something before i die.

nope Scotland....remember the green kilt and bagpipes he played?...the accent too. i always thought about saving my first dollar earned ...but i forgot about it when i cashed my first check. p.s...woohoo ...no longer a junior member

I made my fortune on the seas, and in the mines, and in the cattle wars of the old frontier... I made it by being tougher than the toughies, and smarter than the smarties. And I made it SQUARE! -Scrooge McDuck

What better role model for children? Here's a quote from him: I made my fortune on the seas, and in the mines, and in the cattle wars of the old frontier... I made it by being tougher than the toughies, and smarter than the smarties. And I made it SQUARE! -Scrooge McDuck

I always liked Ducktales as a child. The whole story of Uncle Scrooge coming from Scotland and earning his fortune through hard work really appealed to me (an immigrant myself). Little did I realize I was on my way to finding Objectivism. Here's a question....is an Objectivist made or born? Are there certain things that had to happen in their life to lead them there or could anyone become an Objectivist if they just read Ayn Rand? I think a lot of the reasons why I loved Ayn Rand's works were because I already had the foundations for it (from my parents, school, books and events that happened in my life). Please don't misunderstand this as determinism. I obviously don't believe in fate. But I do think that there are certain things that happen in people's lives that lead them in certain directions. I would like to hear everyone else's thoughts. Did you watch certain cartoons...did you always like science...etc? My husband, though he is really intelligent and has good values, says will never be an Objectivist (yes...he's read the books). I think it is because he doesn't have the same background that I do. At least that is the only reason I've been able to come up with. example: fave cartoon as a child: Ducktales parents fave motto: "work hard, do your best" fave subjects : science and math fave books as a child : detective ones with logic

I always liked Ducktales as a child. The whole story of Uncle Scrooge coming from Scotland and earning his fortune through hard work really appealed to me (an immigrant myself). Little did I realize I was on my way to finding Objectivism.

Love this show! Haven't missed an episode yet. I think its funny that they're calling him the Sherlock Holmes of Medicine because I read in a biography of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle that he actually based Holmes on one of his professors in Med School. I believe his name was Dr. Joseph Bell. They would bring in a man and the doctor would say things like "This man is a left-handed cobbler...shown by the dust on his hands and worn palm on his left hand versus the right one" (something along those lines). Anyhow......GREAT SHOW...recommend it to all!

Couldn't agree with you more! In high school I used to pull a lot of all nighters and on average slept 5-6 hours. However I was usually stressed and irritated a lot. I love sleeping as well. Plan to get a great down comforter with one of those memory foam mattress beds one day. After a good night's sleep of 8 to 9 hours I wake up looking great (no bags under the eyes) and feeling like I can climb a mountain...ready to conquer the world.

Finally saw it today! LOVED it !! The costumes, characters, plots....everything. One feature I especially loved was how they portray what they are imagining and what they are actually doing in real life. Bit of a spoiler... * * * * * * * * * * Favorite line ...when Barrie tells Peter something along the lines of "Don't say Porthos is JUST a dog. That's like saying that a man can't climb a mountain because he is JUST a man"

Welcome to the forum! Tell us a little about yourself? Are you in high school, college, graduate school, working? What part of the U.S. are you from? Hobbies? This place is great to finding answers about Objectivism that you didn't find in books or didn't understand from the books. Also you get to meet a lot of other people with the same values and tastes....there's a lot of variety here. Enjoy! ~Isabel

When I said in certain circumstances.... living the rest of your life in pain because of cancer...was included in it. That said I think you are completely misconstruing the quote by Patrick Henry. Yes, he did say "Give me liberty, or give me death" but that was not saying he was going to commit suicide. That speech was a call to arms to all colonists to rise and fight the British. They were ruled by a tyrant ...their pursuit of happiness was being denied...but that didn't mean they all committed suicide now did it? They fought and that was what I was referring to. You want to be happy in life ....then earn it.

I don't know what the culture is like over there in Sweden (i've heard its very liberal...sexually) so forgive me if I'm being prejudice. I completely agree with everything you say in the above paragraphs. I had male friends that were good friends when I met my husband. However, as soon as I met my husband and fell in love with him he was my priority. I love spending time with him and though I do go out occasionally with friends he remains not just my love but my best friend. Like you said, why would I rather spend time with other people? Now for a story that could relate to the jealousy topic. One night I was given a ride to my girl friend's apartment as I had planned to surprise her and sleep over the night at her place. However, my plan was foiled as she turned out to be a heavy sleeper and never answered her door. I had a male friend who lived three doors away and from the lights on his apartment could tell he was awake. I went in to call my father to get picked up. But it appeared he'd gotten home and had gone straight to bed as the phone was never answered. I spent the entire night talking to my male friend and we became better friends as a result. I told my then boyfriend (now husband) about it and he was fine. He knew enough to trust me and could understand the circumstances. But that doesn't mean I would ever do that again on purpose... or start going out with my male friend on our own when I could just as well invite my husband along ...double date or whatever. There is such a thing as provocking/flirting with your male friends and I would never and have never crossed that line out of respect for myself and my husband. But that's me...maybe I'm just old fashioned but I wouldn't appreciate it if my husband even jokingly patted a female friend's buttox or oggled at her breasts. I don't know what your wife is like or if she has even crossed the line...but I should think there are still some old fashioned women in Sweden. I don't know if I've helped any but I wanted to let you know that I for one agreed with your values of how a couple should be.

I recently watched "Touching the Void" a semi-documentary/movie about a true story and based on the book by Joe Simpson. Here's a link to the summary of it: http://www.pbs.org/previews/touchingthevoid/ I was tearing up a bit by the end because of the courage, heroism and strength shown by the main character. It is truly inspirational and goes along with the Objectivist ideal that man can accomplish the seemingly impossible. I have already ordered the DVD from Amazon. Anyone else seen it? If so, what did you think?

I managed to watch Lost for a few weeks, the last episode i saw did seem to go all supernatural with Jack seeing his father and the other being able to walk so i was a bit disappointed. I miss Alias!! Jennifer Garner is going to be in the Elektra movie coming out in January but i like her best as our favorite butt-kicking spy.

i've yet to see the movie but i have been wanting to see it. it looked good in the trailers and I've always thought Depp was a good actor ...will find out if they're playing at my local theatres. thanks for the recommendation!

just to clear things up... I'm 23 and live in Los Angeles. Yes I am married, but not to SoulSurfer...though sometimes I do wish my husband was an Objectivist as well. I actually did get married young ....at 19 as a matter of fact and would like to concur that its not a good idea to get married young. My husband (who is a year older) and I have had our share of problems to work out. Props to SoulSurfer for trying to work things out. ~Isabel p.s. I totally agree with Betsy that women like to feel "wanted" and "owned"

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