blackdiamond Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 (edited) Hello OO Forum Members, Just wanted you to know that I'll be "coming to America" in August. Since my last "topic" here, I've been trying to get myself into the US of A so that I could prove for myself if this great society has indeed become so irrational that it can not easily support and promote a rational, ambitious achiever (I don't believe it - but I could be wrong). I've been granted a Fellowship by Stanford University in Palo Alto (for my little achievements in Africa), and I'll be there for a year. This will be my very first time to leave the continent of Africa, so it will be an extremely exciting experience for me. Perhaps it is that sense of excitement, that hunger to tangibly experience more of this great relative freedom, that helps a lot of immigrants to achieve more in America compared to some American citizens who might take that freedom for granted? Well, suffice to say that my main purpose for coming to America is not the Stanford program, but to test (and taste) the waters of achievement in the greatest nation on earth. Thank you, Black. Edited July 6, 2008 by blackdiamond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softwareNerd Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 Black is back! Welcome Congratulations on getting the Stanford Fellowship. It's a good thing your expectations are low, lol. You will not be disappointed. As an immigrant myself, I predict that what you will find in the U.S. is that people are no different: no more or less ambitious, and no more or less rational, than in many a major-city of a third-world country. On the other hand this great society is definitely not so irrational that it can not easily support and promote a rational, ambitious achiever. Far from it. For that, it is among the best places in the world. Here's hoping that you enjoy your stay enough that you stay on longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thales Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 Hey, Blackdiamond, congratulations! Hope you do well with it! It's a good thing your expectations are low, lol. You will not be disappointed. As an immigrant myself, I predict that what you will find in the U.S. is that people are no different: no more or less ambitious, and no more or less rational, than in many a major-city of a third-world country. On the other hand this great society is definitely not so irrational that it can not easily support and promote a rational, ambitious achiever. Far from it. For that, it is among the best places in the world. I'm surprised to hear you say that, I have been of the opinion that the level of freedom of a society depends upon the rationality of the populace. A society that would elect a Jefferson is quite different than one that would elect a Hitler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softwareNerd Posted July 6, 2008 Report Share Posted July 6, 2008 (edited) The U.S. definitely has a more rational culture, and this impacts people every day. Of course, this isn't a disembodied culture, so people create it by living it every day. So, you're right that people are more rational. Therefore, for a rational, ambitious person, it's a land of opportunity. I probably have to better conceptualize and better express what I was trying to say there. Here it goes in it's current rough form: when I came to the U.S. the culture and the people struck me as significantly more rational in an externally manifested way. (That's the way that is important in their dealings with me; so, that's good.) On the other hand, I slowly came to the opinion that the bulk of this is rationality by osmosis, in the sense that the bulk of people accept the rational things that they learn from the culture. The part I found not much different from a major Indian city is the ability to go beyond the ideas one has grown up with or that one receive from the dominant intellectual leaders. [bTW: I specifically added the "major city" part in my previous post, because those have a significant number of non-fatalistic, rational and ambitious people. In villages of poorer countries, all bets are off.] Edited July 6, 2008 by softwareNerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Sophia~ Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 Congratulations! Perhaps it is that sense of excitement, that hunger to tangibly experience more of this great relative freedom, that helps a lot of immigrants to achieve more in America compared to some American citizens who might take that freedom for granted? Freedom and many other things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capitalism Forever Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 Mazel tov! Be sure to keep us posted on how things work out for you! Is there any chance for a continuation after the year's up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdiamond Posted July 8, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 8, 2008 (edited) I thank you, my brothers and sister! I feel welcome already! Mr. C. Forever (C for CO2-emissions, that is!): my visa allows me only one year in the States, but I will fully investigate how to change it. Incidentally, the guy who interviewed me at the American embassy told me, "you have to come back to Zambia because this fellowship is a gift - it's aid - from American government to Zambian government." The strange thing is that Stanford is not an American government institution and neither do I work for the Zambian government, so I didn't understand the logic of how it translates to governmental "aid" - but I didn't want to argue, lest they change their minds! SNerd: Yes, your description of African cities is very accurate. The sad part is that when it's time for elections, politicians depend on the rural (non-city) areas to win their elections. Even our current president lost overwhelmingly in the urban cities (he lost to a guy who was promising to cut all taxes), but he won more overwhelmingly in the rural areas (they receive a lot of government "gifts" there, from urban city taxes!). The rural populations are of course easier for an incumbent to impress because they are so poor; so, a small school and a cheap clinic built just before elections is enough to gain their votes. In fact, even Robert Mugabe, the evil dictator in neighbouring Zimbabwe, does quite well in rural areas. He grabbed farms from whites in his country and split the land among black small (peasant) farmers. Although their produce is so small and can not match what the big white commercial farmers produced, they are happy to vote for Mugabe for "what he's done for us". The fact that the economy has gone down as a result is explained as "the work of American and British imperialists who are upset with what I've done against their white people, in trying to helping you." In short, Thales, I'm not sure to which extent the elected president of a country reflects the (level of) rationality of its people. After all, the great American people have to make a choice this year between Barack Obama and John McCain. It's heads you lose, tails you lose: neither choice will do justice to the general, implicit rationality of American society, I think. Mr. Mitt Romney would have best reflected the American spirit (from the pack of candidates), I think. But that's another story. Thanks. Edited July 8, 2008 by blackdiamond Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdiamond Posted October 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2009 Be sure to keep us posted on how things work out for you! Sure. My fellowship year at Stanford ended and I went back to Africa. But just before that, I had received an invitation by a think tank in Stanford called the Hoover Institution to go back in residence as a 'Visiting Scholar'. So, after renewing my visa in Africa, I went back to California again. I'm there now. Hoover Institution is totally terrific! Visit ends next year. Then we'll see what happens after that - in hot pursuit of happiness! Thanks. Do not let your fire go out, spark by irreplacable spark. In the hopeless swamps of the not quite, the not yet, and the not at all, do not let the hero in your soul perish and leave only frustration for the life you deserved, but never have been able to reach. The world you desire can be won, it exists, it is real, it is possible, it is yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gags Posted October 19, 2009 Report Share Posted October 19, 2009 Congratulations, Hoover is pretty prestigious. Mind my asking what you are doing for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
softwareNerd Posted October 19, 2009 Report Share Posted October 19, 2009 Congratulations! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdiamond Posted October 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2009 Thanks, Gags. I'm doing research on "human rights philosophy in public policy". Basically analysing how some modern Western political leaders rely on the new ideology of human rights (through their membership in the United Nations and other international bodies) to push through policies that are explicitly contradicted by the philosophical traditions produced by their own national histories (gosh, what a mouthful.) I'm also investigating some sociological issues with other fellows there. I'm in a particularly interesting discussion with Dr. Thomas Sowell on some cultural and historical issues. But I've said too much already . Thanks. Thanks, SNerd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~Sophia~ Posted October 20, 2009 Report Share Posted October 20, 2009 Congratulations! Sounds very interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackdiamond Posted October 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 20, 2009 Thanks, Sophia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapereAude Posted October 20, 2009 Report Share Posted October 20, 2009 Congratulations Welcome Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whYNOT Posted October 20, 2009 Report Share Posted October 20, 2009 So very well done, blackdiamond - my rather envious admiration to you. Dr Sowell is a favorite writer and commentator of mine, and it must be thrilling to deal with him. (btw, any chance you are considering a career in public office back in our mutual country of birth? An O'ist in Zambian politics. What a thought!) Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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